Season 8 Episode 15: Going The Distance

00:00:00 - 00:05:02

The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world. Everyone welcome to another episode of dateable a show all about modern dating. Let's get right to this topic today long distance relationships some of you have written in to want to talk about this topic. Maybe some of you are in the situation, and we have to live people who are currently in a long distance relationship. We have Sammy Dame it here. They're currently in a much shorter distance relationship than before the Portland to San Francisco. But you used to be London to Portland, which is not that close at all. So just up, you guys wanna say, hi. Hi. Now, we're so lucky that we go. Rare. So Sammy is the one that lives in San Francisco. She's twenty nine years old as of yesterday. Everything has been in San Francisco for ten months, originally from San Diego, but lived in London for many years, and then we have her boyfriend David, he's thirty five years old lives in Portland and has been there for almost thirty years on and off. Born in northern California, technically, you guys are in a long distance monogamous relationship together right now. But you started with a long distance between London to Portland and you were just dating at that point. Jiang wanna talk about that. How did you first meet? So I'll give a little a little synopsis of our first meeting story because I have to do a call out to our long distance heroes who are friends, Sophian max, who's wedding. We met at a Sophia's, one of my best friends, Max's, David's best friend from college, and they were actually in a long distance relationship for about five years between Montreal San Francisco. So pretty big distance. So we met at their wedding, they got married in France. And it was a really practical to do you know a exclusive serious relationship. At that point, we talked every day, but we only really saw each other every few months. We would go on some crazy trip. We did a road trip around Scotland it was great. It was an amazing period of our relationship in air quotes now. Has since that wasn't necessarily what we were calling not at that point. But we also weren't really experiencing real again in air quotes real life. Together, we were it was all like fun, adventures, and it was none of the kind of like nitty gritty or the mundanity of an episode of bachelor. Yes that's one hundred percent. So you met at this wedding like what happened then in, like, why even continued talking to each other or was because my Blake, my lines were so great. Game. You're believe you're opening line was, what would be a good opening line for me to continue talking to you really endear. Yeah. Although it is a line. This was a very metal. I don't know how to approach you so. Line. So how did things progress after you? Parted ways wolster to talking pretty quick. I was pretty nervous about getting interest, because we really have just met at the thing, although we had mutual, very close friends at common for, like a decade before that yet I was nervous about it. But then thought, okay I'll play cool. I'll be I'll be an awesome. Dude about this now lasted like twelve hours or something. And then I found her online and her online on Facebook. All right. Thanks. We're both on the same. And yet and just start talking. I think I mean for meal leased it was so nice to have somebody to talk to partly because same is an amazing conversation Perner, but pearly, also because it was like zero stress to it. It was like here's a person who, like owes me nothing. You know, and do my own thing, other than we just know, each other good people because of who our friends are. So it was just like zero pressure all fun. So is there like a romantic vibe, the first time or was it more like friends that evolved, now it was roaming Mr. scrappy? Well, I mean, we definitely fooled around at our friends wedding that we met at. Yes, it was. It was quite romantic. We actually didn't have a room. I was sharing a room with another one of the bridesmaid's from the wedding, and or other friends room leaving for the airport at like six AM. So in our friends had gotten married in this beautiful massive country house in the French countryside. And we just sat and talked in a study in this beautiful old French Chateau basically until the French nobleman who owned it found us there yelling in friends. Speak, french. So I could explain what was going on. And I was like, come on, what could you possibly explain? I think the visual themselves, like we're young lovers trying to know each.

00:05:04 - 00:10:07

All right. Cool. You're, you're good. Story about it yet. I want our friends left at six AM. They were so touched because they thought we had stayed up to see them off found out that, that wasn't the case. They were a little. Yeah. Up till six o'clock in the morning. And we actually just take over your. Okay. They man David reached out what kind of happened from there must. So we started talking on FaceTime, pretty much every day. Sometimes twice a day. And like David was saying it was really nice where to stress re- person to talk to. He was in the middle of starting his business. I was already super unhappy with my life, London with my job, and it was nice to have this person who was sort of unaffiliated with all of these other things in all the messy stuff in as much as you felt like you were getting to know them didn't really know the other people involved in your life. We were just sort of talking and talking all the time and one night, I was like, hey, I'm going to be a bridesmaid again in a wedding in San Diego. Do you wanna come be my date old? Yeah. And he was, like, don't you were rushing into this. You know this seems a little fast. Maybe we should think about this a little bit. And I believe my exact response was fuck it right. Yeah. Okay. You've convinced sound like such a nerd. Not at all accurate. Your perspective. Same. You told me that she was going to be in California again. But in the context of us talking about people in San Francisco. And she asked if I could get down there pretty Isley, and I said, yeah. Totally have family down here and stuff. And then it like sort of, like, after we'd had that conversation it came out that it was in San Diego. And I said, oh, so were you not going to San Francisco now? And she said, I'm also going to San Francisco but not totally go to LA first. And then, so this conversation kind of developed into like went from let's go on a date together to like let's go on a two week road trip together. Oh. That's the point where I was like, okay, just real quick. Is this insane? And then I get suck it right. Which she says to me all the time now, and he actually wrote in a note when he is something flowers the other day after I had a bad fuck it right? Without his. Yeah. Puma man's. So he agreed to come with me this wedding. And to go on this road trip, and I believe, my, my next response was cool. I should probably actually ask the Bryant of, it's okay if I bring, you is it with a month and a half, maybe before the wedding. Luckily, she said, yes. All. So when you guys met at this wedding, the first wedding, what was your situation. You're dating situation at that point where you seeing people were you getting out of something? I. Yeah, I had been in a relationship like a super serious relationship that had ended about a year before, and had been really bummed out about that for the first six or nine months. And after that had been like sorta dating but not your heart wasn't in it, basically, and the wedding was actually kind of this intense experience from one. It really was like beautiful and romantic and over the top he was in the French countryside. How could you not? And like I got really sad for while. 'cause like seeing what they heard that I was oh, you know, my relationship didn't work out, and then sort of had this big cathartic moment, where thought like. Well, you know, here we are, like, let's go have fun. And like that's immediately the moment. We're saying I ran into each other, but yeah, up until that point had been just sort of like dating on and off, but not in any way that was real meaningful for me. Okay. I'm making out with lesbians. That was a big part of that. Lisin portland. That's why you have long distance. We gotta figure it out. I haven't heard that it was their idea most of the time. All right. Gets more and more romantic fell in love with you because you're not less. Regress, so kind of similarly, I had gotten out of a five year relationship about six months before we met other time. I had also just been dating casually. I had a probably really terrible idea sort of thing with a guy that I worked with. And it was just sort of it was very much the healing phase posed break-up from a long term relationship. Similarly, also just getting to that moment of feeling, like, I'm okay and ready to move forward with my life. So it was this weird symbiotic thing that we kind of popped up in each other's lives at exactly the same time. So now let's go to this road trip that. You meet up again, for the first time with us in San Francisco that you met in San L humanitarian university menu drope San Francisco. What was that first meeting light? It was so weird about it. Long after with this wedding from the last wedding through most not very long. No long. No. I mean, we're both. I think he were really try. It was really weird. I had said to catch a cab to a hotel where everybody in the leading mistake and Sammy said, she would meet me at the airport, and I like saw her sitting in the terminal, and I walked over to thinking, I'd be like sneaky and surprise her.

00:10:07 - 00:15:02

And I sat on next door and she just kinda turned goes high. Yeah. That's pretty accurate. I had. So I had this whole image in my mind what it was going to be like and having grown up in San Diego. I thought I had figured out exactly where needed to sit to be right. You know, perfectly positioned for where he was gonna come out of the store, and I was gonna stand up. We're gonna walk towards each other wind blow your hair music. Softly playing in the background course. So would he? And I was sort of facing slightly away from him. He was he was behind me, basically. And, you know, he said, hi turned around, and he was sitting there, and it had just replayed up. This whole image, I added my water first meeting was going to be like so a really I mean it just really caught me off guard, and I didn't really know what to do. So is like, oh, are you hungry again? Practiced the tropics going to be really bad at this time of days, where we should go eat breakfast. Somewhere nearby unweighted out that was sort of my I just kind of freaked out. Yeah. So off to a little bit of around star premise seeming. It went pretty well overall by lunch. Yeah I'm talking to to Jews. We measured time by meals. Deals. That. Okay. So obviously you leave this wedding. And then at this point us side like were dating or where were you in lake your cycle? I mean, we you know, we like, like Jamie said we started talking consistently pretty quick, pendant didn't much change after California, okay? Other than I mean we kept talking. I think for me, I was like, really excited to confirm that it was a real thing. You know, part of me was worried that maybe it was like I had no reason to suspect that anything was off. But it was just like kinda too good to be true at the beginning, and thought, well, we'll see how it goes down in California, and then want great. And when you say you guys were talking all the time, what were you talking about what were you talking with a future planning was there, anything about your feelings for each other? Yeah. I mean David does love to talk about his feeling. I am crazy for session. I have a live studio. Reporting. Yeah, that's been interesting for me having only ever dated English guys in the past. All of those stereotypes are very true. So being with the guy likes talking about his feelings best coast. Yeah, it's all feeling villa time refreshing to support mealy over. Oh, yeah. For me. So we only really started talking about teacher plans after that trip to California was not the someone who'd given you advice. If you really like her make sure, you know, when you're going to see each other, again, as United Moore long distance relationship, which I will attest to. And we have had moments over the course of the last year and a half, where we have left each other not known in. It's a really terrible feeling is Zimmer. Sad uncomfortable, feeling definitely see that, like knowing the plan. So I guess what was your next plan after California will a big thing that happened during that trip as we said before ended in San Francisco. And during that trip I decided to move to San Francisco from London. So that really shifted my kind of life plans in really big way where I was getting ready to quit my job in pack up my stuff back. There was one trip that I really wanted to do before I left that I had always wanted to do which was a road trip through Scotland. So. We made a plan to meet a New York for a week right after new years. And then we flew back to London together, and he stayed with me in London for the last ten two weeks that I was working at my last job. Right. You're basically the highest dress possible time to just to let it was snug great many months after the road trip was this, that you, I saw each other. It was another three months. Okay. Every three months you were seeing. Yeah, we got into three months varying Kedah that distance. I mean that's a pretty big distance. Yeah. Yeah. I mean we've always been really lucky in the fact that because David works for himself. He has a lot of flexibility soon that's been a big help. And I know a lot of people don't have that. I think we're really lucky to have that. But yes, he came to London for about two weeks. The last two weeks of my job. When I was saying goodbye to, you know, all of my friends from high school in college because I would tie school in college in the UK, and it was very stressful. Emotional time, which was a little bit difficult, and obviously felt like kind. High stakes because we were just at the beginning of building something. And then we went on this trip to Scotland in, like within the first two days, just hated each other, and like, oh my God. Renault? Stuff going on Sammy's his life, but there were stuff going on in my life. Just like finalizing having, like the sort of flannel round of saying goodbye with that.

00:15:02 - 00:20:00

X. That was still kind of lingering. Well, we weren't like dating anymore, but we were still in communication, just like sorting everything out close. Yeah. And so, like all of that came down, same as decision to move, and me wrapping up that chapter my life and all of it like at the end of that December. And then we were hanging out all of a sudden and it was talking about this. Yeah. Them a lot going to sixty. Yeah. Right. He's like, I'm assuming you're like live like kind of living together like when you were there. So it's like a. Yeah. Ever. See someone then you're like sharing every space for a month race. But what we spent the whole month of worry together. So by the third day, which was. Pretty ethnic date, January twenty teen was earth dates Vaso and you mentioned on the road trip. You decided to move to San Francisco was David, like a factor. Like what was your thought process? So I actually wrote David a letter boy off London. I'm trying to remember my freezing because obviously when be bright fear, so much more eloquent than when we speak on essentially freezing. Okay, go remember it yet. You said, no matter what happens between us talking to you has helped me come back to myself, and realize that it won't be back in California. So he I don't know if I get full credit for getting her back here. I also don't want full credit responsibilities. And if it goes wrong, some more like you wanted this life shift for yourself. And it was like an added benefit that you would be a lot closer to each other. Yes. Yes. For those month leading up to the Scotland threat more are you seeing anybody else? No, actually, right before the trip to California. I had to completely cut off any situations with anybody else end was that intentional? Yes. That was very intentional. So you said in your head, you thought I am in monogamous thing, David, yeah, it was more. I just wasn't interested in anybody else at that point, which, I guess, is the point at which monogamy kind of happiness. It wasn't necessarily like we'd had a conversation. I didn't feel like he owed that to me in return. I just felt like I wasn't interested in spending time with anybody else. I wasn't feeling attracted to anybody else, and I was just sort of looking forward to seeing him again and David what was. Is your situation? It's funny it looks to me, actually because I think you were the one who sort of outlined that, that was the understanding, I had, I had gotten stressed about just the idea of, like, are we doing this or not doing this, and recalling you and you saying, look lifted? Exactly, though. I mean it was like, yeah, let's see where this goes, and she's like I don't really care what you're up dude. Done anything stupid or mean and, and all of the same like we're square here. We don't have to have every last little conversation to, to be okay between each other's we can trust. Each other. So, yeah. Like I was still sort of like I think there were probably a couple more making out with lesbians on dance larger, but by the time we're never stopping Hartland. I. Me it's worth mentioning that we as individuals as a couple for a long time, not anymore. But we have this delineation of dance for make outs as people who both really love dancing, and get really into it, where we don't really count because as like of the same weight or mining has non dance yet. On the dance floor you're gonna make. I mean that's just. Doing it, right. That was the last that was the last thing for us to give out was destler. Vague? We're like, okay if you take out, that's what they but dense were out. David this. I'm like the checkpoint Valenciennes on the are just like the annual check of M I, so lesbian. Outset she was still. Learn for public roles. A huge you know what I passed coach now. And I'm sure there's some other guy out there convincing women that they still don't let. You were the one to wet lucky guy. Step up. So while while you're in London in Portland, how to deal logistically, how'd you deal with the times of difference? But I know. Oh, that was the worst at Myrtle. That was the absolute worst part. I mean, it really does for me to be self employed, because it meant we could talk when she out of work, and it was, like ten in the morning, my time as available to talk for not bad for you. You know, I remember semi complaining 'cause she would often talk to me, like at the end of the night, and should be like tire rack should all day or whatever it was an energy, and I'd be like, hey. Yeah.

00:20:00 - 00:25:01

So I did the long distance for six weeks. Not nearly as long as you guys did. But through the London time zone and I think what, what I found helped was scheduling dance knowing that, like, things could change. But at least having that name again, did you guys have any like coordination that way? Or how did you handle things or just call whenever yeah? We did definitely do some scheduling 'cause I remember missing calls that we had scheduled a couple of times, which, you know, very rightly hurt his feelings a lot might describe myself as frazzled as, as a bit of a frazzled chaotic person. I think he would probably agree with that. So sometimes I just get caught up in what's going on and to me, it, it didn't carry quite the same weight that it did with him. Not that talking to him was meaningful on portent, but there's a sort of, like well for not gonna talk right now, surely, we can talk in a couple of hours, but just sort of like honoring those commitments and honoring those times. Became clear was really important. So I stopped missing scheduled the how, how did you communicate that David? I mean, I think it took me a while to figure out what was going on. I sort of, like knew intellectually that, that was sort of sore point for me, but didn't hadn't really Blake had to figure that out. Because like I said, I mostly wasn't eating at all. When I was it was just like sell like, I don't know. So you wanna see nobody was investing in the buddy. So it kind of didn't understand it until I went through a semi and Turner credit. Like, once I was able to explain it clearly she was like super solid about it. But it took me a while to even understand why I was getting so upset about it. No, it was just like. Oh, yeah. Because I've had some unreliable people in my life. Right. I was worried that this would turn out to be that and hypersensitive to it. You know so, like even a little bit of evidence in that direction, I was like, over everything is damned, even when you're like, in the same city as someone in your way from them. Yeah. Start to have your mind wander. Some like thinking about like being in a totally different time zone, a different light environment completely where you really have no idea like what their life is. And like how you dealt with. That I guess, like from your perspective, like, did that come up like, how did you manage having separate lives, and then also bringing them together time soulmate it? We're to read because I would talk to Sam in the evening, but she talked me in the morning. Right. So, like I think if I I would like if I wasn't talked to you, I'd be like she's probably out on a date. And then I'd feel bad about it in the letter of. No, I talked to her at the end of pretty much every night. I don't know if those kind of things must your mind. Oh, yeah, definitely. But also, I was like asleep when it was your nighttime. And so if I woke up and I didn't hook textra Muir, something I might gain the lesbian on ice or. Everywhere. Trying to make out with my boyfriend. And in Denver, make that's your that's right. Yeah. I mean, I think that's actually been really beneficial about the long distance relationship because you are forced to trust that present in a way that you might not be forced to trust them when there's really close proximity in terms of leading separate lives and kind of bringing those together definitely when we first started dating, it was interesting because usually when you date someone they start meeting your friends. So when they talk about things that are happening in people on stuff, you haven't idea of, who they're talking about in realistically, what you just have no fucking idea who they're talking one time. And you kind of just have to humor them and try to piece it together. And it's like a test of how, but she care about that person that you're willing to sit and listen to them talk about people who you don't know. And you've never met in at this point like besides your attachment to that person have no reason to care about their essentially a fictional character as far as you're concerned at that point, we, we've been quite lucky because my group of friends in San Francisco is David's group of friends. Right. Okay. I know there was no necessity to introduce him to people to worry about if he was gonna get along with people, you know, not sunset with super seamless. And then I feel quite lucky that his close. Friends in Pearland are just incredible group of people who have gotten along with really, well, some of whom have come to visit me without him. I was gonna ask you, like how did think shift like I know you're still long distance, Portland, San Francisco, but clearly that's very different distance than Portland to London. However, things changed in terms of long distance in how they stayed the same, we see each other a lot more how often so we have a new rule. The longest we went recently was raped before mid December. We went six weeks without seeing each other. Okay. And that was redesigned to on really not doing that again. Yeah. Seems to work out about a week up right now. Yeah. So we're trying not to go any longer than three weeks without seeing each other. And then when you do see each other, it's full week typically. I mean sometimes samican just sneak up her weekend. But for me to come down here as well stick around and work down here and do you take turns visiting each city, not one to one but yeah, one thing that I that we talked about in the very beginning was that we weren't going to keep score. It wasn't going to be because he can kind of weaponize that and say. Yeah, well I visited he lost time.

00:25:01 - 00:30:23

So you better come and visit me, Bob Leone. That's just not. I don't think that's healthy. I don't think that's fair among different circumstances to right? Like, I, I have all this free time. Miami make way more money in ideal. The considerations are different. Yeah. It's so what we decided was whichever. One of us is able and willing to do it at any given time we'll be the one that doesn't. So what usually happens is I tend to go up there slightly more frequently but for shorter trips. So I'll go up once or twice a month for a weekend. David will come down here, slightly less frequently. But for example, right now here for two and a half weeks that's the long time. I know I'm and I'm lucky got when it comes to that stuff, I have other work done here, and I have friends and family down here. Sammy needs a night to herself like mergers. Yeah. Because you're basically living together when you're here right now. It's like you go from not being together to be really drastic difference. Yeah, it is. Yeah. And I tend to be the type of person who is hyper social also my job is just talking to people constantly do do use research. So they whole job is just like and people, you know, advocating for research in being in meetings and talking in expanding a ton of energy, sometimes when I get home at the end of the day, it just don't, I don't want to do want to open. So we've gotten really good though about being able to say like I love you go away. Finally CU but please go. Three hours. And then I'll start missing you intensely in textile unknowingly, being with lower you coming home, the frequency in which use each other even being long distance is probably more frequent than most people who are dating each other in San Francisco lead the intensity, too early. Living together and spending time together. But the kind of a norm these days of going on dates as you see other at most once a week and maybe once every other week it could be not long distance, but they see each other actually less than you guys, but not usually because you guys are what year how long have you been officially dating since end of may beginning of June of twenty t the last, like, here's what we're doing state of the union. So you really put your foot down talks about this. I want up to Portland and again, I'm I'm just gonna blame a lot of stuff on living in. It is UK for a long time. We were sitting on your couch when you're downtown, and you basically, said, are, are you make girlfriend, or are you going to be my girlfriend, and I got super uncomfortable on embarrassment started sliding on the couch at my face what really read, and I think I joked around was like oh, are we going steady now and you've got very serious, Maya Sisli rises such an uncomfortable conversation for you Sammy. It's not necessarily that conversation specifically, it's more just the open honest tough, you know, like these are my feelings. What are your feelings? That's not something that I experienced a lot of twelve regiment are like, drink. Yeah. Or even like all of my close friends, I owned in have to shake them in disbelief totally what you're actually feeling. So that has been a real cultural adjustment for me coming back to California and may be I lean on that a little bit too much as a crutch. What was it like a year before this? You already been like talking and seeing each other for that year. And then this point you put your foot down, David yet, I, I guess I felt like that. We're doing to where it was possible to invest a lot of time in energy into 'em, like sort of, you know, do it on purpose, instead of just like when a happened or when it was fun or something. It was like, but I don't want to do that, if I feel like of the week, semi could evaporate, this is when semi had moved to San Francisco. Think the fact that you knew that she was moving to San Francisco in the fact that you knew you were moving change the way, the relationship, progressed for sure. Yet. It had in school in mind. Yeah. What is the end goal here, have you guys talked about is, is it's going to be a long distance for a long time. Or is there an expiration day? So it's time to take a quick break and tell you about our coaching special just in time for summer romance were offering a special on half our coaching sessions with dateable team for the entire month. June third. Eighty minute coaching session with either me or Julie will only be fifty dollars priced at seventy five dollars. Just head to dateable, podcast dot com slash coaching and look for the summer special now back to the show. What does the end goal here, have you guys talked about is, is this going to be a long distance for a long time? Or is there an expiration date? So are planned for twenty nineteen was to make points? The meta the meta lines plan. Everyone. Yeah. Yeah. Plans written up make plans, everyone right now the actual plan that we have made is that David's gonna comment spend more extended period of time here over the summer about two months, and that's not necessarily, you know, can we do it because we feel fairly confident at this point, it's just our lives are both kind of coming to a series of crossroads, and there's a few different decisions, we could make they would affect our own lives in each other, and our relationship very differently and they're going to kind of becoming to a head at that point.

00:30:23 - 00:35:04

So I think it's more just giving us the time in proximity to work through that together and make some big decisions together. Outer somebody's make decision. So we're, we'll be living. So I personally would love to eventually move into a situation where I can have a lot more freedom and flexibility like Dave, David, does he call you, Dave. Bye. Uncle. So, yeah, I would love to be in a position more like the position that he's in where he can travel around. He can go to New York for couple of weeks. There are there are certain commitments and responsibilities that you have that you have to be in Portland for on a regular basis. But outside of those no you have this great ability to kind of move around, and be where you wanna be in my mind to be have a home base would very likely be Portland, because it's so much cheaper than differences. No. And I also really love it there. And anti don't mind, the rain big of England. So that the plan is ultimately, moved to Portland. Probably what do you think the plan is to have a plan right about this? What do you think? A real. Conversation with this couple listening stakes a table. It's not just like making a plan to make a plan. That's like this needs to be a conversation between us. You know there's some things that were pretty clearly totally aligned on. There's other things where it's like, well, we're not really sure and, and where we wanna live in six months or year, ten years is definitely in the gnarly shirt, category. I'm not really worried about it. I'm just tired to not live in same city Sammy. That's kinda the feelings I guess, like what is the end point of long distance do thing like not knowing what the employees, sustainable, or like what advice, would you give to people in this situation? I don't think it's a good idea to force an end point. If one doesn't come about naturally, neither one of you should feel like you're having to make a big compromise or sacrifice to fit that other person insure life. I think having it be sort of ongoing conversation has been really helpful and it's more just understanding that you're both on the same page that you want to work toward. Being the same place as each other at some point whenever that point kind of alliance for both of you. And that that's going to be as sort of equals possibly can be. And sometimes may be, you know, I've been talking about applying to PHD programs in a part of that conversation is, you know, what cities would worker you? I'm not saying, I'm going to shoes may d program based on a list of cities, that you give me but it might affect the programs I applied to if I'm choosing between two sort of equally breaked programs in terms of my interest. In one is in a city that you would like to live in her prefer to live in than I'll choose that one. And maybe you'll make that sacrifice for me for five years. And then I can see that back to you in some way. I don't know. I think it's just it's a moving target in. It's about having a conversation and not kind of keeping score and making sure that you're coming to that decision in coming to that end in gold together rethink your comfort to me for sure. You've been working on this theory for a while. But the only thing I'd add is like you know, if you'd asked me year ago, I wasn't so attached to the notion of being in same cities, you read because we want us for a long it wasn't like we had a bad then and we have a good. Now. You know what I mean? It was like, that's what made sense then. Right. And it was super exciting to get to travel and see you and it was like, felt just fine to be able to focus on my own life in Portland. You know when you weren't there, I still miss you. But like it was just a different balance the time. Yeah, we talk about the model of just like having a conversation because the does shift overtime. And that's like that's fine. I can imagine books for whom maybe they stay in that spot for really long time being comfortable in different cities, you know, maybe we'll have kids or some good point though. I feel like being in limbo. When you're in a long distance relationship is probably very dangerous point, because you end up having separate lives at you're so comfortable with, and even though you're in a relationship, you have no joint light together. I think what David's saying if I'm getting this, right? Is like if that's where you are. And. You guys are both on the same page that you are enjoying your lives in also enjoying time together could work. But if one person is like I wanna be like all in with this person, see them every day, and all of that, that's when you get into, like more of a limbo, so you have to be on the same. Yeah, but I know a couple were married and they were long distance. And when they first became a long distances purely for financial reasons, the husband found a better job in California, and she stayed in Colorado.

00:35:04 - 00:40:02

So they said while this is better for finances. Let's just keep it long distance for now until I'm able to find a job in California seven years. Go by pay. Why he went from job to job to job. Couldn't find, you know, super stable, but loved his life in California, and she has really big network in into Colorado, her mom, is there with her, so she's happy, where she is seven years, has gone by there is absolutely no end point there, Mary, and they're both perfectly happy living separate lives. What's the point of being a relationship at how? That compatibility in that person there's a thing that David used to say to me, and still probably says to me, sometimes, but less now because we're becoming more conventional. He always used to say instead of feeling it's something old. Let's try to succeed at something new like why do those have to be the parameters of a relationship is being in a relationship defined by living in the same place sharing? Seems me's is really a necessity and it's a different setup is working for two people for both of the equal happy. I would argue that that's actually the point of being in a relationship is having somebody who loves you and supports you and makes you happy, no matter what the actual circumstances are. So can I add one question I've been dying to now? Because I feel like that's all great. Right. Great. Right. Because I have my own opinion of this. But like I had my very brief long distance. It felt like we were like becoming just friends, and then there was a turning point. But I would love to hear what your attorney points have been ways that you've been able to kind of keep the spark alive despite not being Yvette sales, what he did. Is that even through cicle Todd? You know, there's so much about a relationship going to miss that, like you get from being physically with that person. Yeah, that part that was hard to used to me that was really like, I feel like at this point is the gaps between seen each other shortened, it's like less rough, but just like you're saying, even just holding hands as mental much less. I don't know. I like I never have had a hard time keeping spark alive brio. We definitely have moments when we're apart for awhile where you're looking at this person on FaceTime. And there is like a physical aching where you're like God. I just wish you were laying next during the I could, like put my hand on your chest. Alright. Yeah, not even anything has early overtly sexual. Yeah. We've never had an issue keeping this Mark live. We don't necessarily partake in phone sex. We have a couple of times it's not something that is like very rare. Frontier goofy for you. I make such a fucking joke out of it. Aren't into something else. I would highly recommend which we call naked Miami. So for them. No. So because we're we're both probably, too goofy, for, like, FaceTime sex. We'll just don't talk so much stupider gear at it. You gotta start by being faced in shocker both being naked. And you take turns giving the other person's something to mime. So the person that's not sex billet. Not sexy weddings. No. Like you're walking down the street on your left in Olsen. You see a truck barreling towards the on your terrified, and that person actually get out of bed in God seek his visiting you ever had any would walk it on you doing this, because that would be based, I. Oh, and my roommates are the terrified of coming into my room. This is keeping the spark. He'll I mean. Time we've got something else. I was thinking, like one of those remote by Rita, maybe. But no naked miming Kita along terminal. This is what us failing at, at the stuff devolved into was just like all right. Well, I don't think for cooling off for phone sex. I don't mind. For what could be making for this so much funnier. It's so he's been twins. And is this something like you, intentionally say, like, okay now seven o'clock? The stars align. You know, we're both which is happens regularly for both going to bed, despite living in places that have quakes wean will sleep naked, which is probably not totally wise and win. You're like you happen to be naked already. You're feeling a little goofy. It's like, hey, show me basketball player, drips tank these area this? This. Mima panda. You know, like a panda eating leave while taking. That's a good one. Stay dirty.

00:40:02 - 00:45:25

Texter now. So you do you were than I do. And usually, I'm at work like you have to stop. I love you open messenger on my laptop in a meeting. I opened like in a coffee shop. Pictures? That's trust. Yeah. Keep the sparkle on us. What's up allot when you were broad mostly FaceTime? Yeah, we had a sort of the Lucien from Facebook messenger to what's up to then messenger. When I got a US number. That was that was of Chet eve Lucien, but we realized we've been talking on Facebook messenger for so long when we realized one day that we could be what's happening this whole time, and I think it was there was like a weird intimacy to that even like oh, we have to exchange phone numbers. We have would have because we were video chatting through face with singer for awhile to let nice part of technologies that has made like one distance a lot easier. Lot more to -able, even with that. So we've been hearing a lot of highlights along long does. Yeah. I should what about some of the low lights were there any points in this relationship where you thought I'm giving up. I can't do this anymore when we were in New York, and we were both like. Pretty stressed out there like man. I'm not sure it wasn't like I'm outta here. But it was like geez. I don't know. You know, that's when you were together, but I think it was left. It was feelings from having been apart really. You know, not knowing how to be together. I don't know sometimes it's been when pert for over a month, sometimes it's for us rating. But never felt like I don't wanna see say me and just like at this over with. Isn't. That's totally true. I have never had that feeling when we've been apart we mentioned before that when we were New York, in London, the, the trip, we were like New York, one in Scotland. There was just a big build up a lot of really stressful things happening in both of our lives. And we weren't good at talking about it. Yeah. We weren't really equipped if anything were really equipped for being together at that point in physically in the same space together at that point, which is why two days into this two week trip in Scotland rear were insane injuries in, we just had all of this stuff that been building up in New York. We weren't very happy in the inland and I was distracted stressed? And he was distracted stressed. And we ought to Scotland and we were staying with friends mom. So we were on our best behavior but not really feeling very intimate with each other. And then by the time it got two senators just sort of all kind of blew up in our faces. And there was a moment where we were both just like I don't know if I can do the rest of this trip with you. And we ended up just. Having a really, really long really honest conversation about everything that was going on. And everything that had led to that. And that we had been communicating with each other probably my case hot been communicating with each other. And then we ended up having the most incredible two weeks together after that, after all that stuff is kind of aired, but I think for us, it's always been trying to get used to being together at different points as we've been learning how to communicate with each other and what the other person will respond to and expect from us, and different any relationship. So what are some advice you would give to people? Let's say I struggle with this learning to be together. Because, like, for example, my boyfriend, I see other only on weekends. So we have a whole week of Nacion charter. And when we do see each other, it's sort of shocking to me in a way, I have to like ease my way into it, and I'm not like used to having some with me with some vice you give two couples just trying to ease their way into being together learning how to be together thing that's been really big for me that I think was a huge judgment for us was feeling okay with having time together be kind of mundane and boring in something that brought up with David before because I would get the feeling that he wanted everything to be special and magical, and romantic and life. Can't always that way in my point to him always been, whether or not he actually thinks that will let him speak to that. But my point is always been. We have to be okay with the mundanity of day-to-day life. We have to be okay with the fact that sometimes we'll be in bad moods around each other. Sometimes one of us is gonna wanna do things in the other one isn't. It's okay of we go our separate ways, in evening or its cave, just wanna sit on the couch and watch movies, actually, not talk to each other. We're not wasting time together. We're spending different kind of time together. I totally his every minutes precious, not always with us. We maximize that's just not the way lights sustainable. Yeah. And sometimes, I mean, if you're someone like me who kind of operates on these highs and lows of expending, a lot of energy in the really needing to recharge if I don't get that recharge time I turned into what I might describe, as ouster rather than kind of pushing myself and then becoming aggravated in irritable just being able to say, like it took a while for us to get about point of me being able to communicate to him that I need.

00:45:25 - 00:50:03

Did that time in that space? So I think it's just sort of being comfortable with the boring in the mundane being honest with your partner when you do see them, if you're not maybe feeling excited as you feel like you should in having that be okay? And I think it's always going to be a little weird. I don't think there's any getting around that there's always gonna be that little jolt transition period. And I think that's okay to all of these things are just part of life in a part of China builder relationship with someone and it's probably good that you feel a little weird, 'cause you're excited in which you wanna say and so much, you wanna do, and it's hard to kind of temper that that energy in that, like jolted, I, but I yeah, I I'm as wanted to give vice because I feel like most of our successes have come from winging it anymore. I cry on air. I mean, yeah, I mean, maybe that's best advice. I could give is just if it's working on your terms. That's great. The trick is just like extra figure out what that is. You know. Like prior to San Francisco. I had it wrapped up this whole thing in my head about what it means for David that same to San Francisco and that caused some issues for you. Also, for me, like internally between us because it was like not connected to reality. You know, like, once we sort of got past that, and figured out what we were the project, we were actually working on not just sort of like some notion of recalling, the relationship or something was like, little sort itself out it up. I'm fortunate in that same is pretty good at being like notice. Yes to that, you know, and like and so that makes it pretty clear for me. Very decisive. Yeah, that's good. So I guess whether any moments that you were like, why am I doing this? Like could be easier to have relationship with someone. That's in my own city. Like, what kept you going with this? It was awesome from far away or. I was so late safe, and it was so fun. And like what's the worst that can happen is where you were rats? There's a beautiful intelligent woman who lives on other type of fucking ocean. Like this is a dream come true. So interesting. I think it's really important to take into consideration that we were both coming out of Ryan tense really out term relationships and actually for us locked into this weird kind of like dipping our toes in situation where we started out super far away on the became closer cared about each other more in the distance lessened and allowed us to kind of build up to that in and build that sort of need for each other that trust in each other in, it's kind of neared are keeling if that so cheese. Vada word are healing on ways. And I think it was the best possible scenario for us given the circumstances. I don't think we could've handled that kind of intensity with somebody who lived on the road noticing. You're talking about, you know, most folks when they're dating might not see each other's much Semyon. I do. We're the neighborhood tended out up to eleven. We're gonna launch other everyday right. Whatever way. So better what just yes alike? But we you know, but the circumstances didn't allow for that. And so, so it kind of forced you to take it slower and it kinda let you just gradually organically, develop suddenly opposed to, like, have the pressure to be like in a relationship area, all of that of mmediately. Yeah. Yeah. It allowed us to build something really different. Let's keep in mind, the taking things slower consisted of or second date, being too weak road. Tripler third day, I ask being an entire together, right? Met. And you were both in the same city. I mean it probably would have blown up in our faces. Really? Yeah. I think so. You know, you were talking before about this sort of things he learned from been in long distance relationships, and I think that was great for me to have to actually like sit there and experience my feelings instead. We replace feelings with affection or physical, touch, and we feel like as long as I'm touching. My partner we don't need to be taught. So when you are long dunes like me. Can see you thinking that whereas I would be like, oh, no enough of this. I think you're smooch, equal parts touching and talking. Could segue. Let's talk about some takeaways of this conversation. A lot of good stuff here. I used to think 'cause I've had a few very short live long distance relationships that lasted maybe three or four months. And my biggest gripe west. We never had an end date I always thought with long distance relationships. That's what you need. You need Libya end date, expiration winner you gonna be together.

00:50:03 - 00:55:01

But what I'm hearing from you guys, is what you really need to be working on is working towards a goal together, and that goal could be totally different. And the goal for you guys is to see each other more and be in the same city at some point, but also keep working on his relationship at the same time. So to people just need to be on the same page. Yeah, it doesn't have to be a force and date. Yeah. The other takeaway, I have is I've heard this other couples to win. You want to maximize time as a couple, you tend to schedule things back to back to back 'cause you're like got experienced this and. Listen. This is not just long distance, but even for couples going on vacation. It's so necessary to schedule some downtime. Yeah. So I've had a couple of tell me like me, schedule time to just read or sit by the pool or go shopping heat us something else, so scheduling that, like normal time. Yeah. Actually just as important scheduling all the adventures. You really good point. One really quick. Actual actionable piece of advice that I will give speak speaking of scheduling is we haven't joined calendar knee, and that is so useful. We do actually, in by we, it mean usually, usually Dave Loveridge logo of and. Color coded, and all my notifications or L. Genuinely makes me. So attracted to you. I remember the day you made it I was like beside myself. It was it was a real like a naked Google calendar making session. Me. So we do we do scheduled downtime for together, but it's super useful because we schedule in will put in one, one of us is going to be visiting the other one in the because I've become close with his group of friends in Portland, because he his group of friends migra front, since Cisco are one in the same, we do tend to have a lot of things scheduled in when you're both different conversations. With different people, there's a lot of opportunity to double book than noise each other about things. So one thing that we, you were so much better about this. I am actually just yesterday. He was like Tommy all the plans that you've made. So I can put them in the calendar. But actually doing something like that has been so helpful for keeping track of how much time are we spending with other people how much time re spending just by yourselves which downtime, having no family versus friends? You know, your fronts, my friends all that kind of stuff. I actually highly recommended shared shared calendar for long distance couples, I think my biggest takeaway is like I feel like a lot of times, you're like you have a very defined in gold in line in a lot of time with long distance. You're like with the opportunity cost like it was just gonna keep going forever. And I'm never actually gonna end up being with this person, you're so focused on the future. And I think you guys were pretty much focused on the president. You're like I enjoyed talking to prison. I enjoy being with them. When I can if I can't be with them for three months, that's fine too. But I think also some of it was where you were in life. So I think it sounded like both of you were kind of. Okay with this because you were working on yourselves dealing with your own stuff. So I think. It really comes down to like, if you can have a long distance relationship some of it's your own internal factors to like, if you're the type of person that's like I wanna be with my partner every day have children. Get married live in the same city. Whatever it is, like, maybe that's not for you. But if you're someone that can be more like goal are Tori, I go with the blow seaward as take the moment. Enjoy each other than you guys seem just as close as any other couple that's been if not closer. Exactly. Because you spend all that time, naked talking. Right. Wanna do the quality driving a semi truck, there really? That's good seals the deal last takeaways. There's no right way to do a relationship like everyone. I think like David said this. It's like what works for you and your partner, and that could be what works for you. It might not be what works review. But as long as you to it works on your terms. That's all it really matters. Absolutely. Yeah. There's a formula for a long distance relationship because there's no formula for a non long distance relating. Yep. Trial and error are anyone who thought they were going to get the, the formula for. Rip wellm. Yeah. Fuck polity. Yeah. To the biggest takeaways anything else, any last parting words of vice for anyone who's entering into a long distance relationship or thinking about it. What would you tell them out, say trying to get some out of the frustration of being apart? Try to have that be personally meaningful certainly founded to be for me, like I was doing creative things with it, and I was driving conversations with friends, and it was a encouraging me to be romantic toward Sammy. And it's gonna probably suck sometimes.

00:55:01 - 00:58:56

So, like, what are you going to trade for that? Not only that, I get, you know, Sammy in trade for it, but I also had some personal stuff where it was like. Oh, yeah. I'm actually learning here. It can't just soccer you'll bail out. That's like such a confined of you're sitting there like being like when are we gonna talk when are we gonna talk like you're gonna drive yourself crazy on be unsatisfied rather relationship maximize your time whether together or not, I think the biggest learning for me in this, this definitely isn't specific to along distance relationship. But I think our distances is what m. Emphasize, this is just really being willing to compromise with someone because you love and care about them aren't differences in communication style. Although this might not be evident because we're both just like super verbose loud, individual. But when, when it comes down to the nitty gritty Davidson, much more open person who wants to communicate about things all of the time, and he wants to talk about his feelings, and he wants to talk about how we communicate things to each other, which are all very important topics. I am not type of person naturally, and I tend to see a lot more value in silence. And action in sort of non verbal ways of communicating becoming close to people, and we've both done a lot of compromising to meet somewhere in the middle in. I don't again I don't think that, that's a unique to being long distance. But I think our distance has really rub that out in a big way and I'm really grateful that, that's a lesson that I've been able to learn without experience, not thrill league qua-. Well, you guys. Who are entering into long distance relationships? I think this is a great relationship to learn from even if you're not, I think that's true to me. A long distance relationship is from like knob hill to the mission. I don't. Client cross a bridge and basically London. To find this. Only deal the timezone Oakland. We're always learning from each other, as well even though you guys are so learning as you go along. But we're learning from you to thank you for sharing your journey for all of our listeners are going through something similar something very opposite. Here's my wish was I want to hear from you. If you've been in a long distance relationship for five years, or more. I want to hear from you or one that didn't go fail that long distance relationship. I also want to hear from you. If you've been in a long distance relationship where you never met each other in real life. I know those exists. All right. Let's wrap this up thinking guy, so much again, telling her story, this is wonderful and last, but not least stay. Will your action item for this week is recognize that relationships come in all different types? There's no one right way to do it. So if you find yourself in a situation that may seem unconventional or not exactly how you pictured it instead of dismissing. It try to figure out the craziest wildest most out of the box way to make it work. And then scale back to reality from there. You know, they say if there's a will there's a way there's no impossible when all parties involved are up for the challenge. Want to continue the conversation. I tag, any post, the Pash tax stay dateable, then head on over to our website, dateable, podcast dot com. There you'll find all the episodes as well as articles videos, and our coaching services with vetted industry experts, you can also find our premium y series where we dissect analyze and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums to connect with us. Fine data podcast on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. We're also downloadable on Spotify. I tunes and other podcast platforms. Your feedback is valuable to us. So don't forget to leave us a review on, I tunes, and most importantly, remember to stay dateable.