S7E16 At My Service

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The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.

This episode of dateable is brought to you by five hundred brunches. Five hundred branches connects like minded people with similar interests to meet in real life over brunch. You answer a questionnaire about your interest and how you spend your time. And then they'll match you in small groups of sixty eight at a brunch spot in san francisco get a free entry into a brench now by signing up at five hundred brunches dot com and using the code date able everyone. Welcome to another episode of dateable. Show all about modern dating. Have you ever been curious about the sex industry. What is like to be a professional sex worker. Well we have emily here with us today. And she is a professional dominatrix. She has been in the bay area for eighteen years or italy from london. She's forty four years old poly-amorous trans women queer kick positive and sex positive so basically everything we want to know. We can ask all the questions right now. Emily how are you. I'm great thank you. We're going to give you kind of like a generic online definition of what a dominatrix and we love to hear what you think of it and what we can amend to okay right so a dominatrix zoo woman who takes a dominant role in. Dsm activities might be an in any sexual orientation but her orientation does not necessarily limit the genders of her submissive partners. The rule of dominatrix may not even involve physical pain toward the submissive. Her domination can be burble involving humiliating tasks or servitude is typically paid professional as a term. Dominatrix is little use within the non-professional. Dsm see my small footnote here. I think i do know people. In the non-professional seen who described the as dominik is more about the role got on being paid on obeyed. So then you would say you are pro. Domme or non non dom rights is the only difference payment pretty much health care so tell us a little bit about about yourself. You moved here eighteen years ago. When did you get into this industry. only professionally about five years ago. When i first right in the bay area it was only going to be on a one year assignment. But i just loved it here particularly because on one year assignment doing arms in the software industry. A techie geek. You're in the right place rusty to here. It was the the dot com crash. Two thousand though. I never used to say why did because i was the problem. Okay yup anyway. And then when i go i hear i just stumbled across this ever expanding. That work people were keep positive people. A sex posted people will be. Dsm even back then haw. Yeah those kinds of strengths alike since at least the fifties giving it's just become more public recently the sold insuring right. You know the communities always always been part of it is the internet internet. You had to go. You know a street paper now been pages right not so visible ri- any rest done discoveries various communities and i was like wow. This is great an i thought well. This is me a nothing like this in london so much. I think the issue is in. London is a huge city as ten to twenty million people depending how you count it and there is a quiz or be decem community but they exist in little silom. New york is like that too. Yeah very siloed. It's segregating right so if you don't know about that community you'll never hear about it but here in san francisco. It's way more than i. Also think it is who you know here too. Because i think for years like i wasn't a Like exposed to friends of mine weren't either. Yeah so i think podcast like this and other ways to like make it more just out in the open is really a sudden meeting people like them. One group people met very early on was mission control to know them out with your view. Is this jazz it in this mission control. Okay and they run a series of different themes potties. Okay which are not professional just to town hop Used to be in the city but they couldn't afford the rent navarine. He spanked typical in meeting. People and then people would invite me to a public party. Not that much happens really. But for i got to meet. People invited me to private parties. And so i started the app ending these overlapping circles civil.

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What beach you go from like party. Goer to being in the industry sept two things. One is a been working. The sofa industry. And i really didn't want to do that anymore. I stopped doing nine else thinking. Well you know. Maybe i can very interested in this kind of activity and some money doing this. And how do you start working professionally getting paid for doing this loss of set himself up. I in my case. I actually went on the course. Of course yes. Place in the city called the academy of snl. Oh my gosh. that's amazing and may teach intensive not just for professional people but also for people just interested in becoming more experts in bpm so you go and free day intensive than than off of i i create a website and adds up and i started getting inquiries and when you say you put adds up you mean printed out ads all over the city or online okay. Jeez like google ad words. Or i'd happened over. The years is repeated government legislation which is trying to drive sex work off the internet and so a lot of the main appetizing sites. I used to have some back patriots ample but they go shutdown ties on craigslist. They voluntarily closed the personals So now i advertise on the side. Which is that. She based in switzerland because outta reach the feds in the us and it's called eros. He's ballot eros forgotten. Love out about that life. Is there okay. That's one more kind of just having a presence in the community. And then what is it so when you put an ad up how are you describing your services. What are you offering. Depends where you're at is and i think different domes tend to provoke described themselves differently. Tricks is to really get a feel for who you are unethical. You may turn off some potential clients in not what the looking full but you will find clients who all looking to see so i play up the british as you should the direct commanding yet. Okay mostyn require a nice lead. But i drove myself up. Sound the paul white button up and you know cost it is like what types of clients do you have like who is drawn to this. What are some of the reasons they're drawn to. It will not make it practice of rare. I don't ask my clients classroom questions. Because i've really get the impression the great many of them virtual my clients assessment muslim tend to be a little bit older consisted with finances. Young guys don't tend to have my fee. I also get impression many of them in relationships and this is how they express a pot of himself event competent expressing within the relationship. Do you think that their significant others if they're in relationships know about this or is a secret sauce. Too much occasionally. I you know with a regular client. I get to know a little bit more. What they're willing to volunteer rife and in some cases they do say the pond undis- introver- has an idea but the very much and don't ask don't tell moat and what are your most requested services. The me specifically falls into two main categories. Long which is if you like standard. Biya's up they want to be tied up flogged tortured in some way. I have a preference for using just using my hats. Okay so you know you can do an awful law by john just your nails and soft. Ten deposits people's in that to me oh defined flogged again or the things. Go ahead like in heavy lever pieces and you some across usually across the bomb caring Sometimes you might use a paddle and different people prefer different levels of intensity you establish that from the very beginning her like a really long travel tation a tried to get somebody what their interests are. I find that a lot of clients and no pretty good expressing while they're entrusted him over with a little scared to express what interested in they tend to give me very big ideas. And then i have to kind of matt with a new client of the session is navigating trying to figure out unless working for them was not working for them. Isn't that just dating general. He knows what they're really looking for. The good thing about bedia. Sam if properly trained you have all these little tricks surf example if someone tied up lost them. Is that too tight now. Very considerate don. Right there important because of different If i'm spanking somebody.

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I will them. After a few strokes on a scale of one to ten. Where is that yours asking for feedback. Yeah that's gracious dating to. Yeah larry late so he had another guest before that was into rope bondage. She talked about how it wasn't always sexual thing. What do you see with your clients. Some clients are interested in rope but the vast majority is definitely sexual. You said there were two main service. Dsm the second one. A- one is sissies sissies people who like to cross dress or cross. Stresses often call themselves all. They're interested in forced feminization of in my experience. It any much forcing said these are mostly straight men that are going with the sissmann riot body people yum web of a straight or. Naw i mean at the very helpful definition if alight wearing feminine tie once every month will sir attracts more like being with a trans woman. Who's in charge doesn't make them stray. Okay all this reminds me so the first exposure i had to a pro dominatrix was in college. One of my major was sociology and she came on as a guest speaker for one of our courses and she said most of the men who come to her who cross dress with her will repeatedly say i'm a straight male. I'm a straight male. I only do this. I only do this with you on a straight male. I think at some part of male socialization. Is they struggle against you on way through school. Little boys call of a little boy square overnight. Is that what i say your home. Oh if you socialized as mail you grow up in titular. Balk any interest in bright clothing. You're gay or these is the very interested in seeing some. I mean by and the very interested in my buddy but definitely straight reassuring that well they don't i don't like to tell them to shut up. I'll get up. I just think it gets in the way. Yeah constantly. racial the much say yet is definitely straight Shut up let's move on zackscom. Come in yeah look at the sexual activities happen. I think when you did your definition doesn't necessarily involve sexual content but in my particular niche is walter interested in re interested in the five. I'm a woman but in some respects. I have mail pots because they probably played with six women. Who have dominatrix assist. He might use a strap on and they like being submissive being taken and then the very interested in being taken by me. And that's usually sex. We're talking about penetration. Depends not everybody but most back to the prom that i had met you know years ago. She said she would do these surveys at the end of for services and ask. Why did you come to me. What am i fulfilling for. You and a lot of her clients were c. level executives. Who said i'm so sick of making all the decisions at work. I want to be somewhere where someone else's making decisions for me and tell me what do what do you think are the main reasons why people come to you having the very very i mean i do have bob subset of plants people. I know a strongly suspected quite senior in organizations. They have some power. You know a wave a stand and sit but they they do just won't give in then. I have another set of clients who is kind of a bucket list item. They've seen the fence over things on the internet. Yeah like wow. that's so hall. And then some of them are in do it. Well you know. I didn't see them ever again. If ticked off a buck in stands alarm with all those kazaa huge range. Which one is more common for you. The one one offers or the regular client consistently fifty x four regular clients some much seniors and then people just come and go there any other like commonalities between like race and age or anything like that for the majority caucasian mostly forty plus the more likely to be able to squirrel away so cash because they don't want to be traced by owning a reasonable amount up to squirrel away. Free free which is my outy. He is going to ask you. You mind that hundred hour and weird. This is take place of variety places that actually are dungeons in the bay area. One two in san francisco to in oakland which you can rent by like a co working space usually freaks the client and it could be in a designated dungeons as or it could be at their home.

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Could that no. Uh-huh no never ever been to a client's home. There is a a house use in the city. A friend's house which is more of a residential house full. Some of my class is a lot of equal sissies don't need specialized equipment you know so we don't need i don't need to hire a place. I can just borrow a friend's house. Can you quickly give us a list of all the equipment you have. I ever news smallish amount l. Yeah okay. The equipment has mostly. I can carry in a tokamak people visiting mississippi. They'll be in a hotel downtown. I weigh my business casual. I woke mytalk bag. And i have a nice paddle. A nice flogger. Some restraints a blindfold gag so fits in moloto mind quite large third back. And do you get requests for certain. Oh yes i actually prefer clients who just give me on my website. I'm commented website so my friend full professional name is an assembly and the website is ms fa most heavily em. I l i e oxford o. X. an awadhi dot com and way link this in the show notes on there one patriot says my interests include and so i give list of things i say. This is no exhaust. If you're interested in something else to let me know so sometimes will say oh. I'm very interested in like four or five out of my list. And i liked that because that gives a lot of room to play. It's like jazz. And see how the sessions going a riff on fattening of clients have a very specific script a particular fantasy describing advance. And that's why provide us of my service make fantasies come true but it's not as much fun to me yeah so emily gave us her card earlier and says at my service. I love that my service so you re people good of bangkok for certain like sexual acts. Do you feel like you get a lot of people from out of town. Travelers like coming to san francisco. Okay because i know you mentioned hotels or you at so this lie vast majority of my clients but there are people who email me and say orbiting checking out your website or your ad for years. I'm finally coming to san francisco. I only see that. Because you know some of the cisco's that rotation as far as i know many trend psalms even san francisco never mind the rest of the country right so let me take go to kansas. That could really hot. You get clients to come. I'm sure you do. Who walk away saying that wisdom unexpected. I think so. Yeah sure that happens. The way i work is to have a reasonable level of connection it makes the experience better for both of us. And sometimes you just don't get much of a connection for clients. So how do you filter for that. Do you call them Time to climb in the bonds your own safety. That's taking a step to buy when i get an initial enquirer for new client. My preference might requirement. Is i get reference from a previous person that they've seen who i can in coop. Matiur the legit. If they don't have a reference is true sometimes. I require them to have a good me work. Id which because not many people are interested in all we have an introductory visit over coffee in a public sat in a very public. Had feel them out. Make sure you don't get any experience of being people willing to go for that process. The almost always okay. Absolute ryan do that with online dating. Yeah i see a copy of the past. Thank you very much so that to your personal life like how has this impacted your own dating and relationships. I've done was generalized. From this. Because i am sure. Experience is going to be very different. I'm in too long term relationships. Which predate doing this professionally so my situations. I have two main partners. One being for fifteen years oh zone shortly after cisco is of whom i met through the sex positive community there. So concern is safety which might mean physical safety and safety safe sex and also when you meet them. You're already meeting them in a context of this community there. There's not much explainer you do. So what are your work hours like. I've got incredibly flexible work hours.

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Yeah i see a lot of clients during the day. I'll mir assume they're in relationships. They can answer range not to be at work for a few hours right just to find out. If they're dot coming home at night there starts to be can say you. Yeah have you ever fallen for a client or develop feelings for nine. No i think i distinguished. I have a romantic feelings by do foam genuine friendships and in one or two cases. I've got quite close to people. Various reasons over a number of years. They might come to my social social event in my house or vice versa graduate. social event Well they you guys know each other very intimately so and sometimes they'll introduce me as ms emily. Sometimes they went and see. My name is the reason the hasn't gone beyond like friends though because you're and other relationships because it's like a line of being a client that you would never auto primarily i'm not very attracted romantically to system but have any of them fallen in love with you. I definitely think so. What do you think are some of the common misconceptions about what you do. I think there's a lot of missed conceptions from completely outside clients and the workers you know like a lot of people think that anybody's prostitute better word is abused or victim. More is controlled does sometimes happen big generalization a huge as asian and when you first started in the industry. What was the most surprising thing for you personally. I don't think i was surprised. Renew prior to that. I've been newly sex positive video impulsive communities and some of the people in those communities sex workers. So i already knew a whole bunch of sex workers i think for me. The main thing was just feeling. I felt very nervous. I wasn't going to do a good job. My main concern starting a new job. Thank you are perfectionist. Green imposter syndrome. Starting job stat. Beat up to the standard area because those in that community prohibiting professionally a demo ep very gender gender steer by soften guys just pulled black lever and say i'm on Qualifies you to do that. Also chicks by being a dome. I have a. I have a close friend in new york. Who used to be a pro dom and i. She told me that her biggest surprise finding was that she didn't realize there were so many different types of programs she herself. She is a big girl and she calls herself. The big girl pro dom and her whole thing was commanding. The guys eat that was that was basically it. She would dress very sexually and they would eat meat out at restaurants a lot of times and she would make them eat and then they will watch her eat and that was her knee should so she said there was a lot of different interest true. Were they turned on sexually by this. Oh yeah now. I think it's not exactly a surprise. Major revelations to me i mean you can think about this an abstract sense you know on the internet. You can think of a weird thing possible but sure enough there. There's a sigh and a whole bunch of people in the forum. I was mildly surprised to discover people. Come to see me x. horrified by moslem. oh. I didn't know that was the thing. Have you ever said no to something. That was unprecedented. I wouldn't say no to things where i really. I'm not very good at it. I know not very good. One example is humiliation where i think. Some domes do mediation by as she wanted to. Which was taught by mr smith madari and is very difficult to do well and it's very difficult to rebel. Actually psychologically hurting people you know if you choose the wrong thing to humiliate somebody. You can actually effect courses. Yeah so another figured that. What are other things like. I wouldn't have thought about humiliation as something or eating like what are some other things that are out there. It's time to take a quick break so we can tell you about the latest service. We have been building over here dateable. We've created a platform to connect you with vetted experts from our network to help with everything from coaching with dating therapy dating profile reviews and even ways to get real feedback about your dating style. A sessions typically run from thirty minutes to an hour. And can all be done via skype or google hangouts. So you can be anywhere. Listeners have been sharing how worthwhile their sessions have been with comments about how easy the coaches are to talk to how they have provided a new perspective and how they have created actionable ways to inspire change to meet the coaches and book your session today.

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Visit dateable podcast dot com slash coaching. Now back to the ship. What are some other things that are out there. A real to say leap give it to us. Some clients very much into toilet player. One sort of another and let's explore that a little bit more. Golden showers what else if not that common that some clients like poop when when you poop on them. Were they soup on. You may remember the dome yet. Because i'm again thinking back to the story of the first pro domme met she said one the most requests services was she would be on top of the glass table and her clients would be underneath and they watch her. Pin and it wouldn't even end in sacks by. They were extremely turnoff. that what other ones. Well i mean one of the ones. I particularly enjoy. It is some of my clients very much into multiple. Dunn's so i have friends and colleagues who have clients maybe it's my client. Who would like another to join them. Join us vice versa. And i just enjoyed that immensely either. Two of us powerful woman ordering this little slave around bomber the slave. Oh my goodness talk about co working there. That's much fun because you are you working. Yeah you get a kind of spock's wang you know fine lets you one more example in other ones so this is one which again is not very frequent but i do have a couple of clients as she both from visiting from other parts of the. Us them infrequently who were unto extreme fisting. What's extreme fists while more of them. One how often you have to work up to that robert up you know. One of them arrives with elbow length. Gloves for me and a big bucket of crisco young nazi to down and get to work. That seems like a lot of manual labor involved in allen. Do things a little bit bigger them. Some is it. Is it ever non-sexual things that you're like. Go get me this so much i have. I do one or two dumbs who have like how slaves and some cases one. My slaves went to new york and was a house slave in a very well established dominate choices household. She's done as the baroness l. How he was in her household six months and according to him came back never had sex. Roberta's he was low in the totem pole and household. He was mostly cleaning and the made by friend who in this isn't this happened in new mike. Friend and york was a fitness instructor. Had this guy who is in her class and he said i just wanna pay you money to talk shit to me. Tell me how horrible. I am tommy. Am ugly tell me. I'm poor all that so this one time. She picked me up at my house. He was driving and she said. Don't ask any questions. Just get in. So i was in this car with like six upper girlfriends issues in the passenger seat. Just yelling at him turn left here. What the fuck are you thinking. Turn right year. Her performance she was she was with a straight face and then he took us red lobster paper everything but he stayed in the car. She made sure that he stayed in the car and he drove us all home and never ended in sex or anything but she continued this relationship for about two years. Levy quite light to find people like like what is it. Do you think that he's getting satisfaction by google. Apparently he was some sort of high school football coach and he was so traumatized from his experience doing that that now he likes the roles to be reversed. I don't. I don't know i'm not in. There is some psychology of people who really want to be of service extreme givers and they get enormous pleasure from worshipping mistress and reviving the mistress of everything. She might possibly required and emily for you. In addition to the financial benjamin's what are some of the psychological benefits for you. Well i get to lots of fun. Things i have always been doing. Sometimes it's really really hall. I have a great time ended up being paid less. What is your family or friends know about this.

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Most my friends hin about it. Yeah okay family family. Would you ever tell them not really. No i'm third a little bit old quite traditional and i think they might struggle to understand. So what do you tell them that you do for work. I just tell them. I'm in between jobs. Freelance contract delete ally at all. What are some of the changes that you've seen. This industry go through but when to people in industries they twenty plus years ago They said it was in some respects as much harder because finding clients was tricky so the internet made a huge change and particularly internet made a huge change for people at if you like the low end of the industry people who might be working streets. They could find clients on the web. Rent a hotel room. I'm if anything now by has is changing back has been a series of governmental. laws passed. Which really trying to stop the sex industry. I mean it's ludicrous is never gonna stop websites. The being closed by the fbi and all voluntarily. Because they're worried about falling afoul of legislation. One particular set of bills confessed the susta semester. Which went through in march which may care allegedly to remove a an exclusion under the communications decency act which allows in its internet platforms not to be responsible for content. They post so it meant that we could open stuff on the internet. Saying i am a sex worker. This is where he can find me. Says the foster made in offense to do that and or facilitate prostitution. Whoa seen as i over. Advertising sites closed down and or winter. Shaw and that meant a lot of people who've been advertising on backpage craigslist perhaps didn't have a resources all the money to advertise offshore. They went back onto the streets which is much more dangerous place. The beach one game share. So what are some ways. The communities fighting back we're trying various lawsuits with a being raised against that legislation. Which actually i heard fella the first huddle but they can appeal the various Sex worker activist groups who are trying to lobby in stay on the federal legislation. Legislators and with another hat on. I'm a member of a group who run a co- case which has been working his way up through the federal court system which essentially clair's or challenges california's prostitution law as being unconstitional as an infringement. On sexual privacy. We you know as a as an industry as a set of activists. We have very few resources. Yeah it's sort of. There's some parallels with the cannabis industry. Right chris still stigmatized manures huge demand for it. Yeah so people are either hiding behind closed doors supporting it or they should be out there. Fighting for your first instinct is high right. You know it takes a lot of god's down the middle market with big signs saying you know sex worker rights a human right. How do you think the industry will look like in. Let's say twenty years. Let's use our imagination. I mean there's an optimistic pot. Amee which is the society might get over us like terrible moral disapproval everything and my stop thinking consenting adults having sex as it happens the money in private. So what's the big deal. I mean it took the us in example up until two thousand free to say that it was okay for gay men. So i'm not holding my breath. I mean there are examples is one shining example new zealand new zealand decriminalized it became a not no longer criminal events. It wasn't legalized where you have to permit some of his stuff. It was decriminalised in two thousand and three. And they've had several royal commissions sense which concluded the unbalance was a good thing. That was certainly no bad effects. There was no real change in the level of prostitution but the workers now had much better relationships with please Which occasionally the people be sophomores. Yes right cops. Love the harass ex-workers. Please actually would freed up to go off 'til back guys. Well when i think about twenty years from now and like you said earlier the sex industry is always going to be there no matter what they do with websites shutting down this and that so i'm just thinking about the ease of technology what that could mean and i can see an industry where people will pay for virtual reality. The services dolls greedy via websites which offer sex muslim predominant sex. You think you get the same effect from that bow. Well you'd be surprised with -nology 'cause with haptic technology you could feel touch and interesting and he'll far off for me.

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No i know robots versus a canadian company wants to open the robot. Breath own my. Why houston kidding. Feels like so not sexy but each kind of guessing you know. Typical buyer mcgrath rovinj should ban all arab robot. And the right way is If you look at the internet pretty much every new poverty internet technology was driven. Or i exploited by. Yeah why they said. I know twenty five percent of all streaming video was known yet. Ask probably been overtaken by copy. Does now yeah now live. Stream is so huge. And it's actually a away for a lot of sex workers to promote absolute surfaces undergo a whole industry of cam. Lucas never actually have yeah. I'm a little bit behind the curve. I'm gonna saw offering online so burs by depending on what you're looking for if you just want if you're like that guy. That just wants to get boston around like maybe you could incite them via the internet. Generally a cheaper point of entry. Yeah if you sign up. I didn't know the precise rates by getting fifteen minutes of cam which is generally an offline my skies around fifty bucks whereas now session is a lot more money and there's something about being in your home for because that's a big industry now sickly among younger workers so you just need a laptop in the camera. You want how much you can do. Just let go to some takeaways from this conversation with miss. Emily i think for me. This idea of feedback is always very compelling because for a lot of people who are dating they never ask for feedback especially when it comes to sex because people are so shied. Talk about it that you don't know your partner wants and what they like right. You actually don't know how to ask for the things that you are interested in. So i liked the tactic of starting somewhere giving them something tangible for them to react to versus. Just saying flat out. What do you like right. But i think also to piggyback off. That consent does not have a starting and time suit. So if you're doing something and you change your mind by all means lake place in the world you meet. Some new seems pretty. Hough them forever. Reason is not going so great and maybe you did give consent. yep yeah this is great. It's travis and then you say well actually it's no gun from i can withdraw consent anym- right so it's being open to try new things but not feeling now if you commit to something. You're stuck there either if there are any down realizing like actually isn't for me like you were saying some clients. I mean there's most than combat but there are some that don't and that's what with the web reasonably be yep so other kind of takeaway from this whole conversation. Is i just love having these conversations because i think in media there's certain per all i think hearing from someone that's in the actually having the experience is so like powerful we've had so many people on the show save a hearing from people that were outside of kind of what they traditionally thought about dating and sex and all sorts of things helped them just open up their minds so i think in general sachs as in evolving conversation and people feel like they need to be updated to. Oh i'm into normal sex and into you know the non kinky sex or some humor like i'm only into kinky sex. I feel like sexual preferences evolved with who you are as a person to. I don't think we need to stay static. In our sexual interesting they can also be very situational. Some of my relationships are what you might consider the nila. Nice loving relationships and avas. Aw what you might consider kinky. This isn't being pro. Domme is playing order expressing of myself at a paul. That's an interesting point too. Because i feel like you could also apply that. Even the most monogamous relationships like you could be one way with one partner and another way with a different partner and some of that might just be you evolving but it could just be different sides probably have people on payroll pulley yellow has say with pawn a they express some part of himself constrain because they get expressed the different pau different flavor of himself with another ma and they feel more fulfilled right uncut like that with sacks to you come home after haunting june after dinner how yes act logging man.

00:40:22 - 00:45:02

I think that's also on the flip side a good takeaway. The for people is just because someone did something once. Oh yeah does it mean that they wanted to every single time or it's un-american people are different some people i see they wanted to precisely the same thing every time i see them die. He 'cause i know ram it's great yet and then other people. They're open to exploring. So i i can bring them along. Oh time you know to the point where somebody's claims verve shine. It couldn't be do x. euro to later doing next last interesting. That's an interesting situation. Just even like with one partner of like stand who they are sexually in maybe some of it's through observation but then also having a way that the he opened up to you and i think that's why i'm so intrigued by these play parties because that is an opportunity for you to play with multiple partners and what are some other ways you can find pleasure a lot of times. We can't verbalize. What makes us feel good but at least we can imagine okay when this person did this to me. That's how i felt. I treat lately. I'm mentoring people. You expressing an interest in not just being pro domme expressing that side of himself. One of the things. I've been doing law is going to public play parties at the citadel for example which is just in the corner and i suggest to them is because of the dow get dressed up perceive me feel sexy and is safer. First time i would recommend that. I just watch just be avoided. That was executive advice. We got when we went to a play party. And then you can say that kind of interesting all perhaps you might say none of this interesting right not for me. At least you know you opened up whereas open to it. Here's a realistic question for you. How sustainable do you think this is does sex. The sex industry and being a pro. Domme do you think you. Can you see yourself doing this for the next decade or a twenty years. Do see some people in industry. I get in. I do five years of pretty hard work and if a sensible they score a low money away and then they go on to be a lawyer. I also know people being industry for twenty years because it really suits the way of what they may have. Kids put through school I see a lot of transferable skills to being great managers. i mean protons would-be your best managers at a company. Maybe other no. I think i don't know about that. Actually the mole straightforward fresh environment is the being commanding of as bad result. Yeah you need to be a little more like there's a line there you lead but you can't tell me you're asking for feedback along the way. It's not a dictatorship your daughter on night. One thing that i my mental strongly suggested whilst at the end of every session we do by minutes at the end to just sit down. Help them come down from the highest like a mile down a cool down but also just look maybe cadillac. Molo bear asked how it walls near because it can be a big thing to go from this very intense. I'm for many people are pushing the boundaries or is a huge fantasy film. And it's very exciting and then they go to go and the car and drive home right out. think by. Don't often do awesome feedback. I asked him how does that leave it. Very open ended yet because a lot of their own spot i could see still processing. Yeah or doesn't come to right then yeah right so i guess just like as a wrap up like is there any harder advice you would either give to anyone interested in exploring other than the mentors that you talked about before and finding doing your research and due diligence if you're talking specifically about some interests interested in being a dumb. I think the key thing is to find joel invoice. Some people have it. And that i discovered i did know i can just somehow talk. Talk loud by can talk way. Which in charge not. Everybody has that only have in different ways. So you have to find who you are your voices some people. I know who do sex work. Who do gal friend experience right.

00:45:02 - 00:47:54

They genuinely form an emotional connection for that one hour. They'll really go friends that one they can do that whereas not everybody awesome. Do you wanna say your website. One more time Spell it is m. s. e. m. i. l. i. e o x f r. d. dot com. Awesome and like you. I said whoa lincoln in the show news. Emily oxford and also we want hear more from sex workers. We were trying to get jeremy long on our show the asian porn star but apparently he recently cut off. His pinky has removed himself from the industry and does not want any more interviews due to a really tragic accident. That happened so anybody else that we love to talk to porn stars anybody else in the sex industry we want to hear from you. Because i think it's always good for us to open up this conversation and hear from you. The actual people who want to learn about as opposed to trying to make assumptions that are they're not rooted in anything. And lastly of course we want to hear from you general. You don't have to be a sex worker to be guest go to dateable. Podcast dot com on that note. We're going to wrap this up. Stay all your action. Item for this week is to practice getting feedback. Start with your friends and your family with your co workers and then someday maybe asked for feedback after sex or in sexual situations. This episode of dateable is brought to you by five hundred brunches. Five hundred branches connects like minded people with similar interests to meet in real life over brunch. You answer a questionnaire about your interest and how you spend your time. And then they'll match you in small groups of sixty eight at a brunch spot in san francisco get a free entry into a brench now by signing up at five hundred brunches dot com and using the code date able. If you didn't know already we have a revamped website with articles videos and content. All about modern dating you can also find our premium y series where we dissect analyze an offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums. We've had some great feedback. About how actionable these episodes are so check them out on our website or items music also visit the site today to see the latest about coaching where we connect you with. Dateable approved experts to help with everything from digging profile reviews coaching and even gathering real feedback about your dating style in a personalized and affordable way to connect with us visit dateable. Podcast dot com. You can also find us on facebook twitter and instagram. All under dateable podcasts. Don't forget to subscribe an auto download the podcast on itunes. Or your favorite podcast player. So you never miss an episode.