S6E6 The List

00:00:00 - 00:05:02

The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.

This episode is brought to you by together. A podcast and online magazine that provides tools for better relationships while it's important to navigate dating and early relationships. What happens ten twenty thirty years down. The road listened to stories from real people who have put in the work to form amazing partnerships visit together guide or listened to the podcast on itunes and all major podcast apps. Hey everyone welcome to another episode of dateable a show all about modern dating. Here's a question for you guys. How many people have you slept with. Think of a number a and then of those people that you've slept with how many of them would say that you were a fantastic lover. Okay you have a number of mind. Okay just kidding. I don't really care but today we do wanna talk about the influence you may have had on the people. You've had sex with a lot of times when we talk about our number. How many people we've slept with we think about it from our perspective alive really enjoyed my time with this person or i don't remember this person's first name when i woke up the next morning. But now we're flipping it and thinking about the other way around. How would they describe you. And what is their memory of you. That is what our guests will be talking about today. Her name is kiera hogan hey guys hello. She's originally from australia and currently lives in new york. She's thirty years old and married a little. Bit of background about her cure cheers. Is that your real name. Yeah the amazing. I love to live up to it right even when you're feeling grumpy. No i'm still curious here. Is that your married name or your maiden name. This is my maiden name as stralia. And i feel like it's kind of like the ultimate never ever. Change is a photo based artist whose work explores themes of connection and sexuality within urban dating culture. Perfect for fit for us. Originally from australia cure now lives and works in new york city since the viral success of her breakthrough project. Tinder rela cure was named young creative australian of the year in the field of photography by lost at e minor and has spoken on numerous occasions about dating in a digital world. She's here today to talk about her latest project the list where an acquaintance that she she refers to as k in the book. A man gave her a list of everyone he had ever had sex with. She spent a year tracking down the people behind the names interviewing and photographing them in the hopes of creating a picture of k. As he would be seen through the eyes of his former lovers. Whoa that is. That is daunting so kira. Just how did you find k. K. is a good friend of mine and i mentioned to him this idea. I had my project shortly. After i finish cinderella and he offered me his list n. T been keeping a spreadsheet since high school so it was named number With fest last names and contact details of all the girls dry really. It was just too good of an opportunity to pass up. And why k. What does that stand for. We throw around a lot of ideas but in the end i wanted a letter that would also double as a name. I think i guess. I k as keeper of the list almost like a gatekeeper. So this guy kept not only just the first names. But also their contact info in the spreadsheet. Yeah absolutely had an even like details about the date. So that interactions I didn't publish thursday. But i thought it was interesting that his list with sir accessible and detailed i mean i can't remember everyone might list. I'll be honest. I can't either. I mean brat you said just about like wall reading the list consider your own. How many people you've had sex with. What would they say about you. And what would your life look like a scene from the eyes of your former lovers. They're selling just like so haunting about that. Last statement now. I agree and during the process of doing the project. A friend said to me. You're a hypocrite. If you don do your list. And i found the idea really daunting And i so.

00:05:02 - 00:10:07

I did my earn list and i felt i felt good about it but then over the period of about a week like names like kept coming back to me like ghosts of my boss that i completely forgot and i felt really guilty about it and i wondered like if those people remembered me or what they thought of me and and i think this idea of what your earned narrative would look like if it was told by the people in your life. relate fascinating idea when i read this I thought when i thought about you know the perception that people have of you former lovers. I also think about my own impressions of people feel like it's separate between how i feel about them in the moment of having sex and then afterwards young yet to me they're very different and so the lasting impression is always the after or the morning after with feels like i can remember the best sex had but then i also remember how they made me feel afterwards. Yeah so let's get right into it first of all. You got this list of women that case slept with how hard was it to track them down and also having them to agree to be in this project right and i think that's That's that's the real scale of the project. More than anything is is getting the women to agree to be part of the project Luckily because Tinder ella was so widely published at the time. A lot of the women had already had about my luck So they were a little more excited to be a part of the projects. I also think because over women on anonymous They made them more inclined to be involved. And i tried to keep her really professional. At all times. I do start the whole project with a threesome. So that didn't always But yeah i. I came at it for more of an intellectual standpoint and hurt that they could appreciate the project on the same level and did anyone say no. Oh yeah absolutely. There are thirty eight. Oh there were three women on the list of the time he's since double bat but i think disturb hof women said yes. That's a pretty good number. And how old is he right now. On his twenty eight okay. So he's had a fair share of people in potentially high school college and twenty s is really interesting. he's a very like conventionally good looking guy he's really shy and so he didn't have many partners at all in college and when i went back and interviewed Somebody's go- friends from college. They were like oh he was the guy that all my girlfriends used to dream off and and he had no idea so like i feel like he feels like it's a lost opportunity. Oh my god. That's why his numbers have doubled. Yeah i think. I i think every time. He developed more confidence and definitely through during the persian and hearing all this feedback. I feel like he changed lakey. He started seeing himself the way that the women so him and so how did how did this happen. What what was the interview process like So i contacted all the girls predominantly urva social media and usually he reached out to them. I just to let them know that. I would be contacting them so i wasn't coming in called And then i would like email with them. We set up time. And then i would come around to the house so i interviewed all the women in their bedrooms or the magic happened. That was because i wanted to bring some type of uniformity to the project. But also. Because i wanted to catch them in an intimate space so we usually sit on the bed and i would record our conversations on a on the my fine and then after that I would take the further interesting and were there any overall themes that happened throughout the interviews. Yeah absolutely He is a selfish love the main criticism and the women really like you didn't hold back on on that land and i think also the fact that They found that was he. Made a lot of the women on Dating apps and i i think they felt like that was a disconnect between how he presented himself on dating apps in hurry is in real life and i think it's just from the fact that it it seems to take a while to get to know him and that he's like he presents more confidently server dating apps in more of a written forum.

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And i've obviously i read the book in. It was incredible so definitely highly recommended for everyone but it seemed like some women were kind of indifferent somewhere like upset somewhere like of this was a great memory. Were still friends like what was kind of the range of emotions of these women felt. Yeah i mean. I mean i think that's just like everyone really look if you look back some of your your your meetings with people didn't go so well they might. They might hate user. I wasn't really surprised that i think it's we. Also i also want to point out that you mentioned before it depends. Walk point your interaction. So some of these women. I was into the arena not long after ended and they might be a little bit more bid. Some people have had time to think about it and process at nc at different sir. Everyone's perspectives were through the stallion bias. In oldest thing so you know. I think he had a lot of friendships. Which is why a lot of the women agreed to be a part of the project that a lot of them were met like on dating apps. How many were like longer term relationships more significant versus like more casual He had a lot of casual relationships. That i think is reflective on the fact that he's only twenty eight over the turning point in the book and and it's important to point out that it's not just a series of profiles. I've presented the book in the order. That i met with the girls on and it's a story within itself. I refer to as double narrative. And like i think kind of halfway through the book. You probably hate it. stringer casual relationships. Nearly what a douche bag and then you get to go friend. Which is fest serious relationship on at sixteen and he's just really vulnerable. Sixteen year old kid. Who fell in love and had he's hot. Bergen and i think that's a story that we can all relate to end and she was really cold and she cheated on him and broke his hot and I think that's like a really interesting turning point in the book and then as it goes on. I don't wanna spoil too much but you start to see a different side of him from that point on some of the more like longterm relationships that he's had since then and that's just a great way to just describe someone who were also multifaceted and i think laugh. Himes we see them in one moment in their life and we judge them for that one moment so you know we've all had those people that we've dated who were like. Oh that person's not committed. They're not serious. they're disrespectful but then that's just one moment in riot going through and then they get into and then you find out that they're like in this like long term loving relationship then you start to realize okay. I didn't get to see the whole person. What were some of the interviews. That really stood out in your mind. There's an interview that i did. It's number twenty and they're pretty horrible to highlight they really pressure her into A situation that she's not comfortable with and she feels Shame about it. And i remember. It really rattled me. Because i she was so nice the whole time during so sweet and she laid in kind of like lofta. She retold the story that at the end like she finally dropped to the act and told me that she'd never told anyone the story and she felt rela- shamed and And it's really easy to judge him harshly in that moment But as i said like we've all got a story and we've all done shady. Thanks to other people especially when we're young figuring it out unfortunately their casualties along the way but for a lot of women and some men able to identify with that story of wishing things had gone differently. So did he have any idea that she felt that way in the moment. And what was his reaction. Hearing this. Like years later i don. I don't know if he realized that that's how she felt unemployment but he also didn't deny afterwards he like he was like. That's exactly what happened. again. I i said sometimes it's it's hard to look back and see who you are and what you've done to people on how you treated them. Give me an idea of timing after you interview one of your subjects. do you. Immediately give feedback to him or do you make him wait. I'm it depends. He really loved the entire experience I enjoyed that case.

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Just a little sociopath because is like if it had been me going through the experience i would have taken it. Really hot They like the criticism would have hit me high and I might not survive the whole process but for him like he loved all the feedback. Even the bad feedback unite surly. He used to hang out to like their review. I guess of him in and how they saw him But i'd often. I don't make white and so i was ready to present the entire body of work. I see okay girl. One girl stated i like this quote. She wrote what. I learned from k. Is the people who are not happy with themselves are unable to make you happy. Either on his list temporarily provided him with the security and confidence that he lacks himself. I hope he finds happiness. That is harsh. Like yeah he respond. I mean i. i'm pretty sure. He he loft sorry. I think that's that's kind of what he expected. In a reflection of how that relationship was anyway. It's also interesting about that. you also come an after. Her reaction was emotional. This is not the k- i know but this was the case she remembered. I felt that my entire interaction with her she was very emotional and she presented like three or four different sides to the story. So i think this is a really good Example of lake. She might see this very differently in a furious time when she's had time to like calm down and think about it differently. Yeah also the other point. Is you know people. Who are i. Feel like she still remembers him quite clearly and not so fondly but sort of emotion that sort sort of reaction gets carried over to the next person she meets or the next relationship she gets in so even though they may have had some very like sm- short amount of time together. I feel like that. Really impacted longer term for her absolutely. I think she mentions in conversation with me that she's now in a relationship with a serious boyfriend and that was something. She stressed that she found someone who is now serious about so. I think like Having had that experience with k She went on to look for something completely. Different and just out of curiosity was there anybody. You approached who didn't remember him at all. that'd be amazing. Who i think. There's one of the girls that i just email with And she tells me that she barely remembers this experience except for the fact that she's pretty sure he wasn't able to get it up like every guy's worse fair. I wanna i wanna play around the scheme of feedback because we joke about this on our show quite a bit. What if we sent like a. We didn't exit interview with people that we've slept with or we sit down and you like a survey with them after sleeping with them. There's something about this. That gives him feedbacks so he can do something about it when he first heard all these reactions from these women. What was the first thing that he wanted to do. Oh that's really interesting. He's actually in a serious relationship now. The fast one in many many yes. When i first released the book his current girlfriend in him read the book together. Yeah and i think that it was a really positive experience for him. So as i said because he is sorry introverted this opportunity to hit feedback which he really used it as an opportunity to grow even just to be really specific he took into consideration fifteen talks about the fact that he's not as giving a lava and he doesn't enjoy oral sex and from conversations with his girlfriend. That's no longer an issue. I i think that it was positive experience for him. And i really hut from the fact that he's in a relationship now is indicative of that i had a. I had a friend a girlfriend of mine before getting married. She said. I need to call up the guys that i've wronged in my past reconcile this situation before i get married so she actually went down the list of all the guys. She either ghosted or heart just to clear. the air did decay. Have any sort of motivation an or urge to wanna do that In all honesty. I think it was more narcissistic than that.

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I think that he just really enjoyed having a narrative that was all about him. But i honest but at the same time like it is really a unique opportunity to see yourself the way odyssey. You know all the time. We really get the opportunity to have that kind of feedback. So is there anything that shocked him like. Was there anything that surprised him that he was like. This is not how. I saw the situation where i didn't realize people thought of me that way. I think that he just didn't realize he was such a bad I i i think that he really embraced this ladies. Man kind of That for a while as busy as kinda search shot sir. I think that was probably the only part of the story that came shock to him interesting as someone that doesn't know him. Obviously when i was reading this book i thought of him is like a total player. Like ladies men like typical friday guy. I did not think introverted shy at all like that did not come across. I did as you mentioned like once. I read about like his ex girlfriend from high school. He is hard. I started to like see. That's like why this might have come to be. But i didn't get that so i would actually guess the opposite that he might have thought back on things it's interesting the he had a different perception. It's all about me. He was obviously open to all this feedback wizar- anything in particular that made him cringe a little bit uncomfortable. It's time to take a quick break so we can tell you about the latest service. We have been building over at dateable. We'll be offering a platform to connect you with vetted. Dating experts from our network to help with everything from dating profile reviews coaching to see where you're getting stuck in dating and even waste to get real feedback about your dating style. The sessions typically run from thirty minutes to an hour and can all be done via skype or google hangouts. So you can be anywhere. We're so excited about this. Because so many of you wrote an asking how you can find people to help up your dating games and this should be a great way to get personalised affordable vice. We'll be adding more coaches and more services and of course let us know. There's something specific you like to see to meet the coaches and book your session today. Visit dateable podcasts. Dot com slash coaching. Now back to the show anything in particular that made him cringe a little bit comfortable case he ks not really that kind of guys I would have expected him to cringe especially from a male eager standpoint at some of the the reviews any sexual performance spy that didn't even concern him foursome scene. I don't want to give too much away. But that was like definitely the group sex scene. And that's when i decided to end the project off that because i was like out of control i feel like he's just doing things for the project. Now that was came on this exhibition as saying like he was really enjoying having him Him and not just hand. But he's sex laugh documented interesting now of the women. You interview did any of them are they. Were very honest with you about their feedback of k. Didn't any of them actually give this feedback to him in the moment. Yeah i think. I talk about number fifteen. I felt like she was really hauch with him in her interview with me But i felt. I know that friends and i feel felt like it had been a conversation. They probably had Time and time again I through a nari. How honest women With me because i think there's definitely a way we project ourselves to other people and although i tried to cut through that and get as honest feedback as possible like it's impossible to know How honest it was. And i try to stress that in the book that it's really filtered through so many different perspectives Through tell the story. And it's the way they remember it. And that's clouded by a motion and not style and they told me the story. And then i edit again So in the end This is like a patch. What version of someone else's life. I want to say that this is an accurate version of someone else's life is just version. Yeah but i think if you're meeting a lot of people off tinder dating apps and it's like a one time thing like you're just not going to have that conversation about how they impact to do like one night stands. It's like usually just not that much communication in general so it brings a really good point in this. Obviously the basis of this book. How well do we know. These people that were intimate with So what did you learn from this project here so for me.

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I'm really interested by this idea of your personal perspective. Buses reality sir island that the way i perceive myself could be very different to the way others might think of me and i always try to keep that in mind. I think you touched on it on a counter. That means nothing to you could mean everything to somebody else in the trajectory of their lives perhaps being more mindful of that and just the fact that like everyone has a story. I think that was one of the things that the the big thing about the project. And that that i thought about this is i went through. Is that it's not necessarily A particularly unique story. It's just that this is a story that we all have just an opportunity for people to reflect on their own store. We'll just a way different perspective because a lot of times we're putting our own narrative together right. That's really helpful to. I actually had to do this during like therapy is looking out my different life stages and who's impacted me in one that taught me but it was off from me in my lens. Yeah yeah interesting. Because you're like thinking about like okay. I have this life and all these people impacted it. But how did i play into these people's lives in the last will never know so it's like we can't do this list project or maybe we might not but it's like to be conscious of. Oh if i it's salt someone or do something like plan to their confidence in whatnot. Yeah and a lot of it is also timing. Think really made an impact in my life. It wasn't so much what they did but when they entered my life so you know meeting the sky during a time where i was like so sick of dating and no matter how wonderful he is leo wishes not in the right mindset so in my impression of him it was the guy that helped me to stop dating. You know i was like after this guy of dot. This is over. But it wasn't that he was awful gas. That's a big part of it. And i think you actually hit on this in the book to is like a couple of girls. That really could've been care. Any other guy like there was a number. Eighteen felt empower. Because he was the first day she ever gone home with so not him shafiq he would know that right and then there was number sixteen that said that she was going through a period of depression anxiety in a moment of fuck you face. Two men ah-ha because she was also warning her ex boyfriend. So i think a lot of times it may have little to do with the actual person but like what you're going through in the moment like you were saying you a i think the other thing is like you just don't know what's going on in people's lives now right. Yes absolutely no. I think timing is everything. Have you thought about doing this experiment. The other way around having a female subject and tracking down their male counterparts. Yes i have thought it'd be really hot to find someone to donate the list because this is really invasive process. But i've had a lot of people use submit their earned lists and that's something i'm encouraging. I'm charging people to email me. Their earn less. The project can continue to evolve. And i have thought about during yet and also Taking a little bit of a different. Not sir hetero look at sexuality. I think that would be really interesting. I guess i pretend to rela. I worked with all will mostly men So i was really interested in photographing women. This time an hearing that perspective. I think also What's really interesting with the project is that because of the anonymity i had these really open and honest conversations with women about sex and i think that becomes like a theme that runs throughout the book. I was gonna say it was definitely like if felt like the women. Were very sexually liberated. Obviously this day and age like women are but did you have any thoughts or takeaways from that overall. Yeah that was the most fascinating Houser more sexual than addis and that's was never because of me that was unable following net laid If the profiles are sexual that's because they took it that. Also i mean most of these women live in new york where people Unit pretty open to exploring doing new things especially in the dating scene. Here it can get pretty crazy. So i think That made a big difference. I guess the type of people that he was attracting. He's all started very open to exploring so he was attracting people that will like minded in a lot of them were one night stands to. He had. Yeah a lot of my that. But that's incredible that. He kept their names in their content. No instead friends with saddam.

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Actually very i thought that was very fascinating and probably a testament to his character also. He's told me what before that. He often sleeps with women as a way to defy the friendship. It's a way of almost mostly keeping them in his life. And i say that it's a really interesting manipulation of the way women worked and certainly not something i think that A lot of men do But i guess he felt that they were let connected to him. Unite forever now. He often like builds upon that to create a friendship. She's fascinating so how does your relationship with cage change from this project like. Did you have a new perspective on. We were already good friends. But this is such an intimate project in. He was Soy opened throughout the whole process that we just became fog better friends alike. He's one of my closest friends now. Anything that's how it changed. How did this project impact your own life. I know you're married but did it. Change your perspective out of and dating. I think that i really felt pretty strongly about love. And dating at the time when i got married although i you know i think about it the i actually met and married my husband within nine months and yeah end the person i dated before him. You asked me to be in a relationship. And i was like i'm not in that coin. I'm not ready. And then i kind of got like i met. My husband ever changed. And i often think if he he looks back on it in the same way that some of the women look back on their interactions with k. And think like why don't mean what went wrong And so i think about my own list kind of in that perspective and how people me interesting i will. I think this is a good way to talk about takeaways. Yeah i personally think about this. In a way of we get a lot of comments about being single and dating and being out there and making a feel like. It's just you in this movie about you. Know dating in modern world but i i think through your project. I hope everyone will start to realize that dating involves multiple people. Not just you name multiple characters in this movie sometimes supporting sometimes our guest star some a co star imagine to start realizing that were impacting other people even though your interaction maybe one night or even at our you do impact them and that impact becomes cumulative in their life so for people who are right now actively dating and actively meeting people think about if kira were to do this project on you. Would you want the curb person your whip. What would you want them to say about you afterwards. A good way to think about. It's not so much. Am i You want to be in the moment but also after this interaction. I want this person to take away that. This is who i am. This is how they write out me. This is how. I made them feel ants. Okay if not everyone is like the next love of your life. Sometimes a relationship is just one night of good sex like that could be sometimes with these like people that aren't very supporting actors as you just said. You don't have a lotta time to make that impression in. That's fine but that also doesn't mean that like you need to act like an asshole. What takeaways do you have to I think just in general like you don't really like we've talked about. You don't ever know what's going on in someone's life you don't ever know the real impact you had on them other one like the woman number fifteen year book. He basically kay told her like to get in her own bed after like they slept together and she was just like i will never be with someone that does that and i hope like people in this book or just in general. If you've had should he Sexual experience hopefully not like rape or anything very difficult but like even just stop. That didn't sit well in the moment. Hopefully people can learn from that and figure out what they want in their future or stuff. They'll never tolerate again so even if it was a bad experience there is a way to turn it into a good experience. I think that's that's really important. In this process of reflection you can lend so much and and perhaps With reflects durfee so high on yourself by use it as an opportunity to grow. I think that's a. That's a really positive. Take away from the project. I think the other thing that i took away to like cutting people little slack. Also like some of these. People might have been very immature. They might have had their own self growth to do like. We said you never know what they were experienced in that time. So someone you may have thought was like flaking on your route. You may have had other stuff going on or other experiences that you had no idea about so maybe not taking all these experiences.

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So personally or holding resentment grudges towards them and reevaluating. Like i know for me like i've had certain people that in the moment i was like oh my this is the end of the world it now looking back on it. I'm like wait. What was their name again. Like sometimes like thinking about like. I think like you hit on this some of the people that might have been a little more angry. Where like recent didn't have the time to cool off. So maybe it's like just taking a step back and being like okay. How does this one night stand fit into my whole narrative rub. They're not a huge part of my life. Or maybe at least i can find something beneficial that they brought me. Yeah i just. We need to give each other more feedback in general and to be like. Oh you're peniston work will. Obviously he penis didn't work back as in. You know when you said that in being young comic little bad example will ask me that that makes me uncomfortable and that's immediate feedback because unless we get that feedback we're gonna just keep doing the same type of bribe year and that isn't really our fault because nobody's given that feedback right so we we really got to communicate more in moment as honestly as possible without ruining the mood. Obviously i do like this idea. 'cause i'm just thinking about like what i would do. I don't think. I want to know what exactly everyone with about me. But i can almost guess even if you just went home and said i'm gonna take an hour and map out the last ten people. I slept with and try to guess where they will say about me. I think that could be telling. Maybe it's something that you did years ago and you machines but you can be like okay. I would not do that now. And that's a good feeling knowing how much you've evolved as well absolutely. Yeah it's growth. It's all about growth and unfortunately part of personal growth. There is roadkill along the way. And hopefully that. You're just kind to that. Roadkill not treat them as such all right. Let's do question of the day. This comes from lydia I learned that my guy has slept with a lot more women than i ever thought like five times. How many people. I've slept with in fact. It's almost a turnoff that i now know his number. How do i not let this interfere with our relationship. We'll let you answer that first right so i think that as long as he's castle about he sexual health that this shouldn't be an issue because we are all the some of our experiences and he is who he is because of all the experiences he's had on so i really don't think number of sexual partners Should be something that concerns you. I think just the number in general is so misleading. Imagine if someone had five booty calls that they just slept with over and over again. They're number one go past five. But they're still being promiscuous right by sleeping with five different people at once so i think the number is misleading in that way. It's not a way to judge someone because it's it's all dependent on their life stage and also what they've been through so you can't really feel like you can't really take that into account when trying to move forward in a relationship because relationship is about the future not about the past and also why even ask for a number. I'm sorry i just. I would never wanna know. I don't need to know it doesn't affect me as long as you're clean your you know you're safe. That's all i need to know. I don't want to know how many. But i guess now that it's out in. She knows the number. She feels uncomfortable. Baby she should do. Que did with his girl crowds. If not like go through every one but maybe like what did you learn from this. Wire you in the place that you wanna be in a committed relationship now. I'm guessing obviously. I don't know lydia's boyfriend. But i'm guessing. He was probably single for good chunk of time in order to have a lot of partners. Some may like using this as a way to deepen your relationship opposed to like looking at it as a way. That's gonna like hinder. Not sure if you can move past it. I think it's also important for hut to reflect on why it makes her feel insecure. I think that's probably more to the point of that. It's about why she having this reaction to hypothesis. Rather than how many people had sexist with. That's a really good point. Yeah def to yourself more. I for that he up emmy in this day in age. It's going to be hard to find someone who has no history or no sexual or that brings up other issues and then you can't win with that number right. It's what you've had zero or you had under ten partners. Are you really inexperienced. A you just can't win. It's a lose lose situation so yes definitely look to yourself in an and try to answer.

00:40:02 - 00:45:03

Why am i having this reaction. I actually had this conversation with my husband When we first got together about how many sexual partners we'd had and i was so reluctant to shed for such a long time on. Because i guess it's a different approach for unfortunately We'll influence by societal expectations around sex. And as women as much as i don't one to i still felt like insecure about sharing that information whereas i feel like it's almost like look at all my trophies which is which is terrible. It's terrible that that's the way it is but Nomad like how strong feminist you want to be like at some point on you you are influenced by the society living so i remember shed the not with him and he was completely okay with that and i realized that it was just like i didn't need to be a feel any kinda. Shane just was who i am and where i come from. I mean keep us posted if you do this female. Because i would love to hear the differences because i think that was definitely an eye opening part just the change of female sexuality and all of that. Yeah absolutely. give us a quick summary of your previous project. Tender ella so the cost of three months. I went out on a title of seventeen states using tenda And at the end of each day i took a black and white image of of them. I had an exhibition presented with kind of name. Age occupation And then i make commentary about the way in which we connect with one another in a digital world very interesting. Where can people find your book. And maybe information on that as well So i have a website specifically for the list. Which is the list. By-catches dot com. You can buy the book there and then if you would like to see More of my work from dead. As linked to my main website curious dot com awesome will also link to the list in your profile on dateable so people can access it that way. Is it on amazon or anything like that. No just selling it through my website. Okay good to know. Well i highly recommend it. I thought it was fascinating. It was a really quick fun. Read like an definitely made me think for a long time after so definitely recommend picking this up antastic you so much for joining us on. Today's code really appreciate it and for our listeners. If you like to be a guest on our show we are still booking guests for season. Six am We're always open to new topics. But you know we love experiments if you done experiments about personal growth about self reflection i want hear all about it. What was your seizure. What was your strategy was your sample size. I mean we want to hear all about it so definitely reach out and tell us all about your research okay. let's wrap this up. Stay of all your action. Item for this week is to do a little exercise. Make a list of the last ten people you either slept with or went on dates with write down what you think their impression is of you ho state or post-coital and also write down what you learn from each individual person figure out kind of a lasting impression you wanna make on people and the impact you want to have on people's lives especially people you go on dates with or have sex with or have us do it for you. We're now doing posting exit interviews to give real feedback from your dates to learn more visit. Dateable podcasts dot com forward slash coaching. This episode is brought to you by together. A podcast online magazine that provides tools for better relationships while it's important to navigate dating and early relationships. What happens ten twenty thirty years down the road. Listen to stories from real people who put in the work to form amazing partnerships visit together got died work to the podcast on itunes and all major podcast apps. If you didn't know already. We have a revamped website with articles videos and content. All about modern dating you can also find our premium why series where we dissect analyze and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums. We've had some great feedback. About how actionable these episodes are so. Check them out on our website or itunes music also visit the site today to see the latest about coaching where we connect you with. Dateable approved experts to help with everything from dating profile reviews coaching and even gathering real feedback about your dating style in personalized and affordable.

00:45:03 - 00:45:20

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