S11E11: Politics Aside: A Blind Date Experiment

00:00:00 - 00:05:15

The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves.  I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.

Hey everyone. Welcome to another episode of dateable a show all about modern dating where we dig into the Y Y wise of people's behavior when it comes to dating. Yes I've brought a condom for my mic. I owe a guy I for anyone who can't see I put this black literally black condom over my mic as if it wasn't phallic looking enough now, just making the tip even bigger but I feel like Julie likes it. She's Mesmerized by she can't stop staring at it and speaking of dating Julie's been dating. Everyone wants to hear the update about Julie's recent dates or date I should say or no I won't give it away. Update I feel like we heard the Snafu last week for anyone that missed it was a glitch error that like I didn't get taxed from what's APP but I finally got on Thursday the guide, sent it on Saturday. So anyways, we talk we make a plan like he was the one to initiate like setting up a plan for the following week. Okay. This is you know I was actually getting more excited about it because I know also we talked about like my feeling towards it and I had mentioned that because it was a socially distance date we talked about politics a lot like I didn't really have a feel for it like I enjoy myself. It didn't really get to a deeper. Level, but I was totally open but also wouldn't be devastated devastated if it didn't work out. So that's kind of the back story for anyone that's missed the last episodes if you haven't definitely check it out because there is great stop, but also you'll get the whole scoop. So anyways, we have the date setup it's going to be Thursday night. I'm looking forward to it. I'm getting ready for the debate about to get in the shower and I see message and I just assume it's like a confirmation message but I opened the message and it's basically like, Hey, I decided that I don't WanNa. Pursue US anymore and I'm going to cancel the date. It was very blunt and I said to you. and. I was like, wow, I've never really experienced something like this. I've definitely experienced situations where I thought it was a good day in they just never followed up or I like asked to hang out and it was kind of like either at that point it wasn't a fad or just ghosted never had a situation where someone like believe he was the one pursuing it in then there was a switch that was so blade it like even WanNa meet you at all. You know like I've decided like you're not a fit in the the way he worded it was I changed my mind about US Yeah I. Thought, that was very I. Don't I never seen that or heard that before but it seemed very abrupt a yeah and I think like why wanted to bring it up with the podcast? Is You just never know for US alive? No idea what was really going out of the skies life. Could zero to do with me however in the time from setting up the beach to key set up the date in the we had follow up. And it started off, he was talking about like a side project he was pursuing. So also just background I had not shared anything about the podcast with him. He had no idea even did this like that's how you know surface level. It was the sentate, your last name. No, he did not know my last name. So I don't think he had any idea of this podcast existing so I don't think he's listened to any of the past episodes or anything. So it did come up. He was the reason why we didn't make plans like the week like when we start, we got reconnected on Fridays because he plans to work on a side project with A. Friend coming in from town. So that's why he had suggested the week after. So in conversation, he's like Oh do you work on any side projects or have you ever thought about doing it and at that point I'm like I can't live like I've been working for like five years you'd like. So at that point, I was like, Oh, yeah, I do actually have suddenly at work on these, can you send me the leg in I? Feel like I would rather share about the David cast in person because I think people can it can be misinterpreted like they think that you're hearing all your dating life and maybe recently I have been a little more than. Do I think in the past it was like, Oh, now we don't do that but I think also because it's been some novel right like this whole socially distance date I think because he was my first socially distanced dated actually didn't really was hammer and the what else I was thinking about this like I feel like if a past updated felt the need to update people on every last date I went on.

00:05:16 - 00:10:08

Like such a dime a dozen but now there's something about it that feels especially given. You know he's I. So anyways, I did share with him that I had this dating podcast and I was like I'm happy up let I'll tell you more in persons. We already have the time set up in a Mike I'd never like talk about people beyond their comfort level past axes, etc it's more. About like the stories and just what's changing in modern dating culture but you didn't tell them the name, Ivan tell them the name because I didn't want him to Google. I, think also what? Baby take a step back I think if the last couple episodes we had explicitly D- rocked about this. I was like Oh my God I was like thinking you'll start there right? Exactly. I was thinking about. The last couple of episodes? We like literally like like the last one there's no misinterpretation that was him right with the glitch of like I'm not having tech glitches with that many people and I think like you a you also like on a scale of one to ten I. Know I was like thinking back and I'm like, Oh, I have I heard someone like I know it wasn't. It wasn't meant in like a personal way to him because I just felt like we didn't have that be enter yet. But if I had heard someone be like, Oh, I'm a five like I probably wouldn't be that excited to be w there. So. You playing everything but I'd said I was like, Oh, my God I do not want this guy to hear it and I think that's a lesson to me that if I don't want someone to hear something I, probably shouldn't be saying it anyways by gut feeling is that he google like I literally did a Google on an INCOGNITA. So it's not even music by history I did Julie dated. PODCAST. We showed up like. At the time of like damn our seo too good for our own good and then as your picture you, there's no. There was no mystery. So by guests is that he heard that there wasn't anything else big that would have changed your mind. You know that drastically, do you think he was like getting ready for the day or getting pumped? He's like I'm going to check out her podcast. Honor. God. This happened around like one thirty and the. Because it was like. I was literally, it wasn't like I was about to step out. We're meeting at six thirty. It was like two thirty. But I was like I had stuff the rest of the day and I had a break and I'm like I'm going to take a shower get ready some not like stressed at five and then I'm like, Oh, I guess I have all night to get right. Oaks dot going on this study. Restaurant picked up like it was like He. You know made some plans like it was just very I'm thinking about it. I'm like if he was not attracted or something like would you even beat that plan like he would've known at that point, right? Yeah. Thing was shades if you were listening to this episode now, what would you say to him? What would you want to say too I think what I'm going to take away from this like I'm like I can never control his behavior it literally could be not at all like. I have no idea right but I think for me I, want to share dating updates with people on the podcast. But I think I'm going to try to be a little less specific. I've got a little overzealous because it was the first person. So I do WANNA say like if this did offend you in any way like I, I do apologize for kind of giving private I. Mean I don't think I disclosed anything super private but talking about someone against their will necessarily I think I would. Not Do that in the future and keep it a little more general, that's the trickiest thing about having a dating podcast because you want to talk about your dating experiences. But then there are people who are victims of the storytelling. and. Sometimes, we get caught up in the storytelling aspect. We forget that there is a person behind that story to that's. We've all I. Mean I think any dating podcast error has definitely because. What was like your boyfriend and you guys were a little different because you like knew each other on a friend level I blake when he heard that you did this did he ever reaction at all? Yeah. He was like I'm never gonNA, listen to. I don't WanNa. Hear you talk about me. He hasn't he the only times he's listened to it is with me. Yes. So he can at least react in real time I mean it makes sense i. think that's what it was like thick of this guy listening on his only barely knowing me in the first place right? Like I don't know how I would feel if it was a reverse GONNA try to be a little more conscious of that but I will keep people updated high level maybe a little war ambiguous maybe not real time like that might be the caveat. But your intentions are always good. You're still looking for love. So the intentions are still there you're not dating for the sake of telling stories on the on the I mean, I think it's interesting though because I'm like about like my.

00:10:09 - 00:15:01

Axe not like my like super serious that left for the UK like i. told him I think on our third day and he was definitely like would I I told him he was like a little taken back like you talking about me on this. Aston I'm like, oh no, that's not what it's about, and then he's like wait why are you talking about this past? We had built like Sacha report by that we were already like super into each other. So I think hearing that like when you can like share it I not through tax like you can just share it in person you already know this person's a genuine person. I think that also changes the context a bit yeah I don't think he ever listened either. It's a little awkward. Other acts is like all about it he's like talk bobby whatever. Be. So, yeah. It really just depends on your personality, but we also had like way more history and we dated even before I started this thing. So away, it's just hard to sometimes put it into context with New People. Yeah. Absolutely. But you also it's such a big part of what you do is you don't want to hide it no, and if someone googles, you can easily find it. Yeah. It's a tough one. That's why you gotTa Change Your name on these dating APPs. I told you you got to change it but what am I gonNa do go on a date like for like three dates and then be like, oh, by the way my name is Julie. I was lying to you the whole time. Yes. Therapists. Field the same like I'm sure like there's other occupations that are super intimidating people. It's not just this right right that's true. Yeah. We just have to find a happy medium I. Think your role is right that may be at you don't update in real time and they are not as specific but you can talk more high level. Yeah I. Mean I think thing another thing that's going to get into the. Episode. Today. On our first date I think the reason I walked away. So like Luke. Warm is because we talked about politics the whole time and I think it's hard when it's so fresh right now and F I. I wanted to go out and vote before we go into it that is our huge takeaway here but I think we talked about it. So long we actually had similar view so it wasn't like A. Butting heads situation but I walked away being like that a good conversation I'm glad I heard where he's coming from but I have literally had that convoy with you you. You know like there wasn't anything about him that I learned the I didn't really learn like what made him tick like what he who he was as a person like it was kind of like it was very interchangeable I think will go into this episode like I think politics. Are. Really good to gauge someone's values, but it might not like it might not be something that warrants at the entire conversation. Then you're losing out on them as a person it's such a hot topic right now especially, this week this week is going to be more how can you not talk about politics on a date right and the next week? I. Mean it's just GonNa be hot topic for so long but we made it the only topic. To say. Yes we did. We did. We did this experiment we were asking for people to be set up on a date with someone who may have opposite political beliefs and we found two people who are willing to do so and we got them on a date but the first half of the day they could not talk about politics. So that's the difference. Right because like if I was on this date with this guy, we only met for like two at hour and a half. Two hours where they like basically spent in our I. think it was like an hour and a half without any politics talk we actually gave them the thirty six questions to finding love to like kinda guide it into a deeper way, and we also set them up on a cooking challenge. So as a virtual day, but we made it a little more entertaining interesting in. Yeah. It was politics was not on the table at all the first half and then the second half. It was. Open the flood gates. Let's talk about interesting about this too is we didn't actually have two people that were super extreme like there was one that I mean, the two people we had Kiki and Tom, they were both wore like independent. That's how they considered themselves. Kiki definitely leaned towards Democrats. She said she's only voted for Democrats in the past she was voting for Joe Biden. There is no question. About that, she's a black woman to she felt very like things were personal with trump's so she's very against trump and then tom on the other hand is more conservative. He's still like he's not. He doesn't identify as full right but he's more. He's still more conservative. He used in a very conservative upbringing in calls a cult.

00:15:01 - 00:20:01

Yes. He he calls it a call. We didn't call it a cult he. Was Self self-proclaimed words and he also liked he was basically debating between trump in Jorgensen who is a libertarian candidate so he was very much no on Biden just the way he thought like he didn't believe in the way Democrats Rian Office and government practices. So yes, we had two extreme views. We won't give too much away. It was dot what I was expecting at. All I think there is a little bit of a roller coaster on this of changing I kind of went back and forth like maybe this is a batch maybe this isn't a match like it just kept going back and forth. So definitely tune in for the whole thanks it's A. It's a ride to cure people's like dates. You know it's always good to hear those two perspectives of the same date. The contracts of the State is so unique because you go into it knowing that you have different political beliefs you would never go on a date of real data in real life and you could if you were unhinged says, what political affiliation you? You definitely could. No. Get says like liberal conservative it doesn't say that Republican but you still could no hands down but you're also not going on a date just to argue. Your for your case but this. This context it was knowingly you're going in with opposing political beliefs and seeing if there is a romantic connection like you're going into it with this mindset that it probably wouldn't work out. So then yeah, the expectations are pretty low, but it is I agree with you as a very fascinating outcome of what happened. It was like a roller coaster we couldn't. We could not get a good read the two of them. But. At the end of it, all we had a lot of takeaways. So I, I will leave it at that because we don't need to leave it at that more for anyone that is triggered by this like both people were very open in they said like that was what they were. Their expectation was that people would sign up for this weren't going to be like Super League racist comments or like just like the things that I think are very triggering to people and I think for me that was I opening. When we posted this, there were a lot of comments like I would never like all people of this or this very like blanket statements and I think even talking like we actually talked to a woman that we didn't end up going with because we couldn't find a match. They are more sense the people we chose, but she was saying that like she gets like outright hate. For her views and I think like I mean whether I agree with them or not or whoever agrees with them are not like it's still like a lot of judgment is being passed right now without looking at the person as a person in I think it was a reminder by other things. I. Keep getting all these alerts of Republican facebook groups that I joined to find. We actually radically using Eddie what it was like listeners of this podcast but I liked joined a bunch of Republican groups that I keep seeing like pop up and I'm like I got to remove this. Yeah facebook is so confused by your political beliefs right now she seems like she's undecided but the the main point of all of this is to go vote. Yes voto vote it is so important early vote if he can heard us and get your voice counted, it is very, very important and get your voice counted when it comes to our reviews to we want to hear. You. If you go into apple podcasts, you can tell us what you think about us us five stars. If you think, we deserve it and leave us a little comment or along comet, whatever it may be because we want to hear your voice why you're listening to us in how you found us and where we can even improve. We're always down for more feedback and if you WANNA, talk to us even more instagram were. Always on Instagram, and if you feel like you were inspired by an episode triggered by an episode, you want to be a guest on the episode Diem us on Instagram. That's the easiest way to reach us Yep and then the facebook group just WanNa. Do a quick kind of PSA is we do have questions like one of them is like what does being dateable mean to you and that's the only one that's technically required. There are some obstacles to, but we actually are looking at those because we do want to make sure this is a safe space and especially right now in the time of politics, there are a lot of like the often like fake accounts out there we definitely don't want to be denying dateable listeners but if you don't give us any info, it makes it hard because we also don't want to be leading. We just don't. Know. Who's listening right we can't put your name to this. So you know I knew it only takes us like it's maybe a little wine to write something that takes a second if you could just kinda dropped something.

00:20:01 - 00:25:11

So we know that you're real human in that. We know that your dateable listener that will help us keep the communities safe. So big announcement time shall we is it a big announcement people know about this but? It's it's a repeat of. Immediate. Gallo announcement. We launched the sounding board and we have already gotten so many people join this community. It is our newest offering that we've been. We've been trying to do for years I think we've been like thinking of a way to help people date better and smarter in in a context of personal development. So it's not coaching. It's not telling you all these shortcuts or hacks. It's really about digging deep into who you are knowing. Yourself better and how you can take control of your love life. So we called it the sounding board. It is a a monthly offering and their multiple tiers to it. You can just go to dateable podcast dot com slash sounding board to find out information, but we are limiting the spots. So we can have more quality attention or paid solidly attendant everyone who joins, but you should join by the twenty ninth of October. Daily but Yes twenty. Because on the twenty ninth, we are having our launch event basically, and we're calling the dating council where Julian I will weigh in on your latest dating conundrum because I'm sure we've all been there where something happens and you're like a need a second opinion or I. Wish I get more People's opinion on what I should do next yet will now it's your chance on the twenty ninth of October if you're listening to this on the day that this comes out tomorrow so you gotta sign up now. Sign Up. So if you sign up for the Sounding Board by the twenty ninth, you will receive a free invite and this is an invite only event. So you'll find you'll receive an invite to this year. I'm super excited about this, and also like if you don't have a conundrum, you can just watch like you don't need to participate. Obviously. We want to help people as much as we can wall making entertaining but I think we this type of stuff I'm why I'm so excited about the sounding board is also in addition you a and I recorded our first of exclusive audio that we're putting in the audio series that everyone gats like helps you kinda like take inventory of your own dating life helps you navigate all the ups and downs like the down I was talking about like I admit it was. A little discouraging like giving that shower ready to go at a dating, they getting that but I thought back to how I would have handled this like the years ago. I. Think I would have taken it a lot more personally. I would've maybe even just blamed him where in the fats like, yes, it was discouraging but I could see how can I react to this ended up like going out with a friend and we had like a really fun nights I'm like okay was. Able to like not dwell amiss thing poorly about it, and also like what can I change in the future like that's what's in your control and just seeking out like what other people are doing is never going to really help you get there. So I think that's why we're super excited about. This is that we can help people really shift. Their mindset is a the reality is we can't control what dating throws at US or when you're in a relationship new stuff comes. Up It's all about how you communicate how you perceive it in how you move forward in addition to having access to both Julian I dating Sherpas. You also have access to each other other people who've joined the sounding board to use as your sounding board as well, and we are so cute on creating a quote high quality community that is really at pathetic and also just create listeners for each other. So it's not just us. It's also this community that you're subscribing into and. You know I. GotTa. Take the time to thank our sponsor because sometimes we just need all the sounding board that we can get right? Yeah. Well, thank you so much better health for making this episode happen in these unprecedented times some must be experiencing some crazy feelings i. know I felt some feelings that I've felt in years know that you're not alone in this and knowing that work in your mental health is the best thing you can do for yourself right now. So better help offers online counseling with professional credible and compassionate therapists in a safe in private. Environment their counselors specialize in depression pandemics, relationships, trauma, and many other areas with three thousand US licensed professionals across all fifty states they make it easier than ever to find help, and in fact, so many people have been using better help they are recruiting for additional counselors in fifty states. Now, for dateable listeners, only you ten percent off your first month with the Code dateable guest star today by going to better help dot com slash dateable join over one million people taking charge of their mental health.

00:25:11 - 00:30:01

Again, that's better. Dot Com slash dateable and use the Code Dat. L. E. for ten percent off your first month and switching gears a little big. You'll know were part of the FROLIC network and their ton of other fabulous podcasts on the network as well. One of them we want to give extra attention to on this episode. It's called too stupid to live in the comedy podcast hosted by comedy writer and actor Becky Feldman along with a hilarious guests every time and what do they do on each episode they reviewed romance novels that are five dollars or less cuts, right? Each episode is filled with naughty reviews, sexy excerpts, and perceptive analysis on those steamy book covers she covers the gamut of romance genres that may even go off the rails a little bit like dinosaur erotica. Yes, dinosaur. Erotica. Not. Sure what that could be, but you just gotta listen to the podcast to find out it's called too stupid to live and you can find them wherever you consume your podcasts. Wow. We need to talk about Dinosaur Erotica of Delhi GonNa to for that. Seems like a topic that we need to go out I have no idea what that even could be. We half a wishlist of all the topics we WANNA cover, and that's definitely not on our list yet. So you know. WHO has a disorder Roddick Fetish anyone anybod-. Out Live for every pot that's what we always say they're always on her. So what if all your political views are opposing but you both have the dinosaur fetish then you`re Just meant. So meant to be. Okay. Well, let's see of hard to guess are meant to be Kiki and Tom. Tom Your. Thirty four years old you currently live in New York. You've been there for three years originally from Georgia where about an hour's drive west of Atlanta and but a five year stint in New Jersey and between Georgia and New York been for just about three years now, and you say that you're pretty single, you've been taking dating sabbatical but before the pandemic was more single and. Going on dates, you're registered Republican in new. York City although you do tend to swing more libertarian, we love to hear more about that on your date. Any other important stats about your political views and beliefs that should we should just get it out there. Now it might be worth saying that you know I know someone who's who is said, put me in a room full of conservatives and I feel like. The most liberal roomful of liberals and I feel like the most conservative I. Often I often do relate to that statement in in recent times decidedly tended right of center, which is probably true. Then again, it might be I might feel differently if I were in a heavily conservative area and you were raised like a bit more conservative is at crafts I was raised in what I now described as fundamentalist closet. Other things I'll give you example. My mother has never voted in her life l. she does have. Opinions. But when I was a kid, my parents told me and my mom told me that she had never voted because she and my father believed that voting was a male responsibility and basically. An should have the right to vote. Bit of where I came from and I to say I don't subscribe to that or many other aspects of that system. Got It. You said that right now you're still undecided if you're gonNA vote for trump or Jorissen is that correct? That's that's correct and Jorgenson is the independent I didn't even know. Was? Joe, Jorgenson, the Libertarian Party candidate, the double check this but I believe she is the one and only third party candidate who is on the ballot in all fifty states what why were you interested in doing this experiment when I saw the when I saw the call put out there. I. Thought it would be an interesting thing to go into intentionally. You know I've been on dates with people who didn't share my political leanings, but it was never politics rarely have I really discuss politics almost never have I discussed politics on first day or with someone someone through a dating APP is that because you are in New York where everyone's pretty liberal like the majority is liberal could be I haven't. Given much thought to that that angle question honestly, that might play a part into it. People often tend to get so polarized and hostile toward people with views that are different from their's which I try not to do.

00:30:01 - 00:35:07

Personally there are some people friends of mine and professional colleagues whatever who I think very highly who don't necessarily share the same political belief systems or philosophies going into something like this with the intention of seeing how it goes I how both people react and respond to the situation intentionally with kind of opposing viewpoints politically I thought would be valuable experiment love this open minded mine sad and just being open. What are some of your expectations going in with first date in general? Common saying, which I tend to try to try to live by is no expectations whatever happens happens I would expect that. The other person would would have some level of open-mindedness and that we would if we get into political topics where we might disagree I would expect that we could have a civil conversation I noticed in the facebook group where Julie put out the call I noticed that someone posted a comment a derogatory comment like I could never I could never be with someone who was. Put out a few tropes like science denial and so forth, which I think are maybe some degree of truth in some cases but big oversimplifications. I figure someone who would say who would make that sort of statement probably would not be interested in the sort of experience. So. That reason I I guess I do have some autumn an expectation that it would be someone who maybe I'm probably in general may be closer to the middle then to the far left although I could be wrong about that. There are people on the far left and the far right who are more open than. Than some of US typically associated with people on the fringes of the political spectrum. So is there anything like politically if that if she disagrees with you in a way that would make you kind of feel like this is a day you have to exit that I would just be like this is the date now, I, I really don't I really don't think. So as long as as long as she. Is Open to discussion open to open to civil disagreement. If that's you know I, I don't really think there is anything that would result in you know I can't continue this date even though this is a social experiment and it's virtual, it's still a date. So what did you do today to prepare yourself for this date? Like what are you wearing right now this is your your state attire showed it off. Like a purple color, Polo Yeah. Polo jeans below that. How did you choose this outfit a figure? It's not too casual but also not overdraft being virtual thing home do I wanna go go into overdress mode no Bungee I want to go in and a a ratty t shirt and shorts exa-. So probably, no, have you been doing a lot of virtual dates this one of your first a couple of months ago as I was just starting to get my toes back into into the scene, this'll be a first time on video. Oh Hey. Zoom Virgin. You are brave. Love it. So how are you feeling? How are you feeling right now before we take a break to hear from your date and then we'll send you on the date. How are you feeling before we go in here a mix of excited and oh, maybe a little nervous I've never done a the virtual date thing before and I've also never done an experiment in which I'm going on a podcast or show or whatever for a dating experiment I you nervous at all about the political. CIDERS more just the same predate jitters that you would have on a normal day maybe more of the same day jitters that I might have a normal day but I think I think the show the podcast aspect may be adds a little bat. Got It. Got It definitely seem very passionate about politics. You're knowledgeable politics are also open to talking about it, which is what's GonNa make for a very interesting day that you're about to go on are you ready to meet your Kiki ready as I'll ever be? Kiki. What's? Left she is looking gorgeous. We'll have you describe your outfit a little bit. But who are you? You're thirty five years old currently live in new. York. Love that you put your Zip Code on your own. Occur west side. Originally from DC she's pretty single and she's been on a sabbatical like everyone else during covid and she is a registered Democrat anything else we need to know about your political stance that using is very important for the Audience Chalet Correction I'm a registered independent but of always voted Democrats.

00:35:07 - 00:40:02

But even in New York I thought you needed to registers either in. Repulsive, I am registered with Washington DC. Lead. There we go. All the. Registered with DC forever and so yeah, I'm a registered independent by always voted Democrat. The main reason for that meeting independence I just don't like anyone thinking they automatically has my vote like you know what I mean. I want everyone did I feel as though it should be that you come and you actually put things on the platform that people care about and that's why they vote for you and I felt more and more lately lake. It's supposed to be that you just vote one way or the other based on your party and I would and. Were to folks going further and further apart because we just have these two parties extremes, I feel as though that's causing the problems and issues, and if we could all try to see each other and get more aligned and kind of come closer towards the hill I think we would be much better and so to do that and to send an example, I've always done what I think more people should do is register and now I think that's very smart. I was talking to my friend from Australia and he was saying you don't register with the. Political party, but you vote on policy. Yeah. So you're not divided by the s local like party believes, but it's more like where do we stand on just on this one particular policy yary smart you're planning on voting Democrat this election yes. Yes. I'm voting for Biden harassed a resent. So I guess that being said like what made you interested in this experiment even though I really feel as though we're divided in a lot of the reasons we're divided seem to come down to the core values and beliefs though like I feel like there big differences. I still feel as though I am hoping people are open like I'm hoping to still change minds like to bridge gaps, get people to get aligned in. I'm not willing to be open. I can't expect someone else to be. So that's where I'm coming from. That's a really good way to put it I feel like people are taking that onus on themselves ever even though you're very openminded you're also very passionate about politics. So have you thought about what are some maybe triggers that someone could say that would make you leave the state word tell them on. There's I mean you're completely insensitive to race matters it will be very difficult for me. I mean, I, think there'll be some things where I just feel like this is someone I don't even know if I could be around like it could fill violent to me and so that would be a response where I'm done. And just to give people, color can't see you. You are a black woman. So I think that is important also put in Con- Yes lack movement I opened the talking about raising racial injustice and whether I mean I've had debates about whether or not systemic racism racism exists. That's fine. But there's just like if there was a certain boundary cross in that would be huge array. Might be out and they were here about it. And if that happens you. You know that's always an option to call it but I think generally outside of just things being really insensitive I. Think I would be pretty okay. I can hold my own I can stand my ground still be respectful. So yeah any expectations going into this date none whatsoever I think this is like. I know the fun part of it like my expectation is and maybe I am already biased I guess going into it right like already like are are we going to even get along? So My expectation of romantic connection is already pretty low but I'm open to maybe that changing but yeah, no, not a lot of like expectations yet maybe the expectation maybe we're not going to get along. Expectation? But I'm hopeful I'm bill bottom. Start at the bottom. So what since this is still a date what did you do to prepare for the day? We see you in this really nice yellow top that is. I actually like my hair brushed my teeth even though Oh you wash. What. Is this like your first have you done a lot of virtual dates? This is a first for me. I don't even know what to expect. It's weird. Well. Both of you are video days Virgin Guy. You know it's funny because like I got dressed I don't wear shoes in my house. I'm still wearing my slippers but I'm on a date I don't know it's A. But at least you're wearing hand that's usually optional for video day I mean figuring out the right lighting angle stocks so I mean if we're moving around, I might have to take my lighting with me.

00:40:02 - 00:45:03

We'll see how that goes might be like one second. ringway. May Now. Okay. So before we put you on the state, how are you feeling right now? Surprisingly, really nervous even with like saying that I have like no high expectations I'm still really nervous. I. Don't know is that because of being recorded on a podcast is that because he's a the opposite of you politically probably all of these things it's I haven't been dating. For a while this is my first virtual date. It's being recorded. It's with someone who's completely different political views like I. Think all of these have added up today to be like a lot of nerves. You have a drink nearby. Oh, I was preparing one I was trying to see if he drinks I to see like how much I'm going to be. Thoughtful we'll see other Chechen. Crazy. Outshot all right Kiki get that drink ready here comes your date room. I mean it might says if you could invite anyone in the world to dinner who it'd be I mean, mine is probably. I mean everyone will probably have this answer but I think it's because she's such an interesting person I really WanNa, talk to Oprah. And really do I mean I feel like she sees people souls, I think the conversations never superficial. I, feel like you get out like you that experience like getting so much out of it. You know what? I mean. Someone someone with a lot of a lot of perspectives I was coming up with an answer and an answer coming from completely different point of view and that is I was I was going to be sort of. Silly answer but I was gonNA say well, right at this moment it would be you because we're already about new this dinner thing so. So. Nice That's much nicer. Answered the mind. Great. Way To start this off. Preston yes. Would you like to be famous? If what way? So? This. Okay. So I am studying to be an actress so I think by definition out. I hope if I get the roles and the success that I won then that would end up that way. Do I want to be famous? Not Real? Like I could figure out a way to do amazing role that touch people and impact before out things. Super. That would be great. I hear you on that and I think my answer is similar I am so I'm a musician owe and so yeah, the the arts we have something we have something in common right there if I were to do something. A composition recording or Some project that that I really felt was of great quality and something I was really proud of a part of me says, it would be really cool to you know for it to be known to everyone and maybe for my name to be known at least very widely. But then then at the same time, do I want all the difficulties that maybe are associated with fame with grapevine being a household name being stalked in the streets by everyone everyone everyone and their mom trying to get your autograph Kenny, the Grocery store or or whatever. Yeah no one hundred percent I. Wish there was a way to like have you know half of it but I, think they both come together with each other. So I don't know what does it ever stop you from wanting to be musician though will you take it? If it happens I think I would take it if it happened EACHO. I asked I pulled a joke. I said I asked. Why did I del across the road? You're this one. The Cross, the road. So she can say, hello from the other side. Eye doctor after a night of swing dancing and I pulled this Joe. and. Next thing I knew watch song came on over the speakers where we were L. UP and other side. Curtain and was like Oh to play it for you now you. Say That was pretty good for all of them cross the Road Joe. Yeah yeah I definitely need chicken. One hundred percent I let my personal habits, the skeleton but you know why didn't the skeleton cross the red because he didn't have the guts to. Back. Yeah that's my all time. Favorite. Way Do we have to start cooking. We probably should maybe one more question and then.

00:45:05 - 00:50:11

Are you are you hungry now I'm not hungry and I'm a terrible I'm going to don't my way through this. Well. If it makes you feel better, I am also. A not a great chef. By any means we'll. We'll see holiday with this dish. Tom One hour into the date. How are you feeling? How's it going so far? It's fun. I mean the first word that comes to mind it's going pretty well, we're having we're having some very good conversation the we start with reading those questions to each other and some of those turn into kind of springboards that resulted in kind of going off on other tracks and asking our own questions. So we haven't gotten anywhere near the end of that list. So let's like one thing that stood out for you so far from all the things you've talked about that's kind of like a highlight. While the the first thing that came up the that stands out is just a couple of all things we have something in common in that, we're both in the performing arts in one way or another actress musician. We also both have a thing for dance in some form I dance west coast swing, or at least they used to before everything shut down. The one of the questions what would be your perfect day we both had similar answers as far as like a couple of options for me. One of my possibilities would have involved hiking. Another possibility could have involved west coast swing dancing. So her answers on that hiking or even being in a park that. We had a lot of interesting answers in those regards in common another the questions involved tell your life story in four minutes or less. She got she got through hers and she has quite a story and I haven't gotten to mind yet. We figure we maybe we'll pick that up after that's a cliffhanger. So it's on you but now it's not fair. You have all this time to think about your story. Yeah it's the way the timing worked out and trying to multitask to while cooking. This recipe is something I'm Gonna I'm. GonNa have to experiment with again after this. Activity I was doing like an activity on the virtual date. Well, it's a little less awkward than I maybe would would have expected I've done activities maybe not cooking. I've I've done activities like this with people over zoom or whatever before it's more, it seems like it's more conducive to some form of meaningful connection than I would have expected an activity like this to be and I think it seems to be facilitating something a good a good evening what's standing out for you so far about the and about your date Kiki, the conversation is is flowing much more naturally than than some of my answer your questions. That tells you something. Compensation seems to be flowing pretty naturally on both of our ends. Any red flags so far wouldn't say there are any red legs so far just going off the top of my head have you ever dated someone like it before honestly I don't know the best way to add I don't know how to answer that. In this hour or so she seems she seems like a pretty familiar person already I could say we barely starting to get to know each other and have you dated interracially before like is that something you're open to or how are you feeling about that piece I have been on a black at least of A. End. Maybe. A couple of cases second dates with someone of a different race or ethnicity. I haven't been in anything approaching long-term interracially but I how I have been on dates with in the couple of cases at least that led to a second date. So that's something that you've been opened to before. Yeah. How do you think she thinks the date is going? If you had to guess. I wouldn't want to put words in her mouth. I get the impression that she's getting a getting a decent vibe as well. I could be wrong but just judging from the conversation I think she would probably say it has a pretty good vibe as well. So are you feeling like a romantic connection or is it like is the too early to tell what is your thoughts? I? Think it's too early to tell I have never tended to to think of love at first sight if anything I may be to I. Don't tend to fall for people easily based on how while my patterns have been and the past and The this is like someone that you could date or like you feel. Like what's kind of your feeling so far? Maybe maybe okay. Oh, open and if you had to describe Kiki to your friends because they're curious, you're like, Tom Tell us about the date that you just went on. What does she like? How would you describe her? She's very a very personable individual with whom I have a perhaps as a number of things in common common interests or.

00:50:12 - 00:55:03

GENU-. General fuel-cell Harry. Good. Very good. We're going to bring back Kiki now, but we're not gonNA have you in the room while we speak to her of course, right everything kept private for now But then we're GONNA have you guys go back into the date room and proceed? Kiki, do you love me? Going you know it's going well like honestly I think the. Two people that would never stop and talk to each other or meet each other like I can't imagine like when that would ever happen but it's amazing how much you can have in common with people. So you're saying like in out in the wild, you will never meet each other or connect with each other. But for some reason, because we've connected you the universe brought you together, you're able to find these commonalities. Common I. Think The arts was definitely one of the things like he's really into music. He did musical theater for while I'm really into acting and theater as well. So that was something and then dancing I didn't expect that but like I love. You know I dance at every opportunity I can get granted. It's hip hop, but he also really loves dad's even though his is swaying you know what I mean but it was very interesting to like find some of these things when we describe our perfect day, they were actually similar I was like, okay interesting leg both of us wanted to be a nature or GonNa hike and you know have dancing of some sort but if you liked about him so far outside of similarities if anything. I will also say knowing going into this that was going to be talking to someone who's like potentially a trump supporter. You have these ideas of like thing especially being a black woman sometimes you have an idea of like are they just going to be rude to me or they they? Probably he was probably also wondering if I'd be rude to him a recovering end with like all this negativity and it was really nice to talk to someone. Have Him be so nice and play 'em positive at and just like really really gentle sweet soul kind of thing. I'm getting so far. You know what I mean. When you say that you don't think you two would have ever met on the street or out there somewhere. Why do you think that is why do you think that? That would never happen even though we have these similarities were very different still even though we have things in common, they're still different enough that are past would not cross I. Don't Imagine I would see him at the in concerts I would be at in even though we both like music. You know what I mean and it's just because maybe I haven't even been exposed to his type of swing dance before you know that he goes, I could end up loving it. He was like Oh you can incorporate hip hop into swing house like, oh. Okay. So. Is there anything that you're like unsure of any red flags that are popping up? He hasn't talked about his family much. Yeah. So I'm curious about that I think brought my family a couple of times I mean he didn't mentioned very it was like the last question was like give us your four minute background. He told me he mentioned being growing up in a fundamentalist Colt and being home schooled. I need to know more about. You. So, is there like is there a traction like? Could date or is it more friend vibes right now I'll save right now. Read. Vibes. But I was even surprised by that much. No. I'm taking it very slowly like you know it's growing. More so I definitely feel friend vibes, but we'll see how the rest of this goes and who knows when you hang out more. If the date ended right now and he asked you on a second date. Would you go? Yeah I. Probably would just learn more. You know what I mean because I'm not I'm not sold one way or the other yet. Okay. There are not oh, it's. It's kind of like I need more information. Okay. You'RE GONNA get more information because we're GONNA, get you back there with Tom in the date room and politics is on the table now. Like have fun. Hannam going on this topic though like does that shape how you see women's rights and things like that I think the main thing is like, are you pro choice or pro? Industry. US. That's A. Good question and the answer the answer hinges in part on these, I would call buzzwords pro-life pro-choice. Like those those terms get thrown around the lopped at what point does does a baby.

00:55:04 - 01:00:09

In or out of the womb, become a person with its own agency whose life should be protected is at the moment that the baby fully makes its exit from the mother's body is some other moment shortly before then what is the defining point if you define that point as being something previous to birth then then how do you defend? Abortion except in cases where it is necessary for the life of the mother, which is an exception I would. I would always be inclined to agree with. So I would I would say that I tend to lean. I. Would tend to err more towards the pro-life side but I don't really buy into all the pro-life count either yeah. And some some may say, well, you haven't experienced at which you can't experience it which. Is True. I think it was really instincts I read this article upside. It's hard for women seeing to and terminate their pregnancies especially if they're later and they carry them or you know what I mean that's it's like a part of you. Especially, if you get out of the past like the first trimester, let's get past that. Which I think is a lot of things that people talk about like if you get concept point and not pointing women generally have the sense of like trying to keep it or they're thinking about it like it's it's not an easy decision to just turn on and offer make you know of a woman chooses that makes a very tough decision like that which taking very difficult to me I'm just kind. Glad she gets to makeup because encampment he's choice as as someone. Asks Ring The bell and the accident on the sense of leg. Using Products Nygren out of high school in College and I was on my dreams about the go up in smoke because either he can't use the congress to write a up made to be a hundred percent effective upon you know what I mean like my whole life about to go up in smoke of everything that I. Once more my parents were Clark floor leg I wouldn't have been able to provide child I would have ended up right back into the world that was thankless eight you know what I'm eating And so I had to register as a Republican in order to vote in a Republican primary in in New Jersey or New York was not the case in Georgia. which had open primaries. If I were going to stay with open primaries, I would be registered as an independent. Registered right now independent. It's really frustrating because they can't putting the primary easily people that acolyte but. It's one of those things that I always identify with. Democrats. So I guess what makes your identified war with the Republican candidate isn't these specific issues or is it something else? I just don't how much confidence in the democratic approach to some of the economic issues about that would be that'd be one big thing, and then we come to one of the controversial things of course, is the issue of the courts. I guess the best the best explanation I can give without. You know it's probably one of those things that once we end this, the perfect answer will come to my head or maybe not evaluating preceived pros and cons I guess is nope I mean that makes sense I guess. Deeper somewhat late because for me and maybe this is late trump to me has represented so much. Negativity Way I think about him referencing law and order not denouncing racist. and I think about you know his rhetoric and been so aggressively to me it just. Like. I don't think he's been running things very well condemning. All of these things to me have feel like almost like personal you know what I mean. How do you feel about that? When you hear some feeling what he's doing a very personal on purple dealing with that job simply be for that passion for that and then towns that inform how you decide. I think I could start with the denouncing races and saying he certainly could have and I would argue should have made a stronger statement than he did like that moment in the debate but he speaks off the cuff and his off the cuff remarks don't always come over very well, even I think. My other kind of counter to that is I think his bark is worse than his bite K. Tom is back. We started with cooking and getting to know each other and now for the last hour, there was talks of politics. How did that go? It saw we had a civil dialogue. Just one simple answer. I think the were points where we both see aspects of each other sides on the few issues that we got to talking about this sort of conversation.

01:00:09 - 01:05:02

Yeah. It's just it's unusual for a first I in my experience. What topics did you guys talk get to on this? was there any that you had common feelings towards? Were there any that you disagreed drastically. So we got we got into the abortion issue and philosophical philosophical questions around. That which is, which is what my approach generally is things like a woman's experience and all the various aspects of all that and where you know I fall I don't necessarily fall one hundred percent in the pro-life count, but I just tend to lean a little more direct not err on that side as opposed to I don't buy all those all the arguments that side sometimes uses but but we got into that we got into and then In Agreement on this topic or was it more of a discussion? It was more of a discussion. Okay. I would say it was more of a discussion I. I don't know if I would even say more of a debate than make more. I mean I guess what's the definition of debate versus discussion? Get. I think that's the difference between. And I wouldn't say a guy, he'd. Say to civil. Civil. Yeah. It was. It stayed civil I mean I. Don't know what would she would say. It stayed civil and we got into we took a little side side topic discussed religion earner, respective histories and experience. They're all we got into trump in general west. One Way. Full. Potential. Inflammatory rhetoric surrounding are not necessarily inflammatory rhetoric but lack of lack of as clear of a denunciation of white supremacy ideas like pat as as he perhaps could have given what was that discussion like? Well, the discussion will basically got came around for me saying when in the debate the moderator asks are you willing to to denounce or to condemn white supremacy? I said that that statement he could have and I would argue should have made a stronger statement against then he did but I still considered sure I'm willing to do that to by Default Beit Enunciate? And by I said that I would his bark is worse than his bite not a very good off the cuff speaker off the cuff comments. What was her reaction to that that you kind of saying that she talked about feeling threatened she talked about dealing with racism since it seemed more more personal to her which I can empathize with for at least try and it will while this is a conversation and it's a discussion not so much a debate. Did you feel any sort of blood boiling at any point where you felt like you really needed to? Yourself in topic blood boiling know there're moments where I you know I felt like the discussion we had some disagreements. Of course I wouldn't say that I sense hostility on either side it's day tense. Got Headshots. See did disagree on abortion and trump was there any other topics that you hit that you also either agreed or disagreed on into the question of the court system and constitutional? originalism we're not necessarily in agreement on that. Again, I wouldn't say that it got heated got at sea guys. Basically, if I'm understanding it, you didn't agree pretty much on any of the topics discussed you would different views, but you're able to have a conversation where you could hear each other's out before we had you doing all fun things asking fun questions during cooking date to the five change at all with the politics side or did you feel the same that you felt about Kiki before that? She was easy to talk to you guys had a good vibe how are you? What are you thinking I think the vibe just the overall vibe changed in that. Naturally, that kind of discussion will often result in in some sort of tension at least at least in my case I'm not I'm not necessarily one. I'm certainly not one who seeks out conflict I would say the vibe some changed a bit in that way I think we still had good civil discussions and points found things in common. When you talk about the tension, can you explain and describe that tension is is it good tension is uncomfortable tension is a sexual tension. There's just so many ways. I would characterize best sort of an uncomfortable. And Even if I feel very confident about my ideas and philosophies, there's a certain tension in trying to explain them sometimes.

01:05:02 - 01:10:00

So how would you rate the date? Then from a scale of one to ten the entire date it goes from the very beginning to the end how would you rate this? Comparison to other dates pat I know there's a virtual element, but try to take out the virtual helmet. To take out the virtual element. That's you know I always feel like I'm terrible at these kind of numerical rankings. I would say, maybe a seven. Okay. Well, that's pretty high. Okay. Would you have rated it more at the beginning of date unless at the political side or was at a consistent job I okay. I think definitely definitely more at the beginning and less in the in the political side and that kind of. Over to a romantic scale to so on a scale of one to ten, how romantically attracted are you to Kiki? So terrible with these scales serve putting on the spot. I would say, maybe a six. Oh. Hey. I never buy into the you know love at first sight seeing anyway. In person and probably even less. So in a virtual, but you know so would you do a second date? Would you do socially distance park date or something? I would consider it. Yeah, acting. Okay. So it's it's maybe Getting a maybe. Also not a fucking open, but you're not you wouldn't be devastated if she said now right I do WanNa know because I'm going to ask her the same thing is, what did you acquire any new perspectives politically after speaking with her at any point in your conversation? Did you say to yourself high never thought about it? That way that makes sense. There was one point where I said I. Never thought about it that way it was not purely political. We were talking it was where religion and politics were both kind of in the mix and we were talking about the Bible and it. It's you know a historical contexts in which and how it's been interpreted interpreted differently by different Christian groups. She brought that into the picture when the subject of constitutional originalism on the courts came up. And I said Oh that's an interesting point I've never thought of that comparison. So one time I happened to be here to give you your ten minute warding I got a glimpse of some of the Congo and it was when you guys were talking about trump in she was saying how the statements he makes. You were saying they aren't necessarily like his bark is worse than his bite to that comment and she was saying the way that he says that Mike as an African American woman, it's hurtful because it basically makes it right for people in. It's kind of like it puts it out there that it's something you can do even if it's not super explicit permission like did you have any feelings towards that because I heard you saying like I. Can empathize with you a bit but what were your thoughts on that piece? That basically, that was my thoughts again you know I can empathize. I can hear what she's saying and say, Oh, you makes you feel whatever it makes you feel and of course, you know it's something I've heard before. Ride it goes in still goes into the overall list of pros and cons so to speak and I said. There was one point where she said she she mentioned a case where. When she was school years ago, she had like someone had written a hateful racist message on the wall of a bathroom or something. I. Don't remember and I said Yeah if if trump were to say something like that, I don't think there's absolutely no way I would consider him. It's a to your point. You just don't see it as extreme necessarily that you hear where she's coming home right at an I. Do see there are some who are extreme who may be support him, but a see them as also being on the fringe. So after doing this experiment taking Kiki out but just in general, would you go on a date with someone else that was more liberal or more progressive? I mean and I certainly how before it just wasn't it wasn't in a context where politics were really potentially on the table. Would you see I guess a follow up question? Would you go on a date? We're politics were discussed because I mean I'll be honest like even on dates I've been on that are not recorded from this podcast politics comes up because it's it's big right now. So if it was to come up on a date and that was a conversation where you had opposing views, like would that be something that you could feel like oh? Okay. Having that conversation or would. After this experience you'd be like this isn't something I wanNA do. I think it would I think it would still be a maybe you know case by case basis. Okay.

01:10:00 - 01:15:06

Okay. Let's We'll have you give you a break and then we'll have you come on just it for a very quick wrap up at the end to stand by Tom. Hello Hello. So, how did the date go? The part with politics on the table go for you that one was harder dating. That would've gone probably very differently isolate feeling like when you're kind of like meeting someone new in like in this situation, you're not trying to be too offensive whereas if we were like in a relationship at this point in like no holding back. What do you mean? Bark worse than. Bite. It's a dating situation like any like the same thing applying when you're meeting someone for the first time you're dating someone for the first time like you're not gonna be or at least for me I mean I'm not ready to like the stakes aren't that high again you can walk away if you need to like, you're not gonna be as like in someone's face about it, but you didn't walk away. So we didn't get to the dealbreakers where the major red flags were. You Thought, Oh, I'M GONNA. No I didn't think. No I definitely didn't think that because I. Felt like he was very open still in respectful. And listen to what I had to say. So that's it. I do feel like I was more interviewing him. So I felt. In what way it was one-sided with me like going into him. But what about this? What about that? What about this? You know? So it was more challenging as it was meet more mead challenging him for shore and then him responding yeah. There any areas because he told us in feel free if there's other that guys is taught, he said you talked about abortion you talked about trump and you talked about the court system. Yes. In a little about religion not I wasn't sure how that came in. But was there anything that you agreed with him honor was pretty much opposing views on all the topics. I think pretty much opposed on every. well, I think we'll know because he didn't take a hard stance, one way or the other with abortion. It seemed like he was like very, he seemed to me like he didn't have a solid stance because he's balancing it out and at the end of the day like I guess he is more one way. But when he was approaching me, he was definitely not defin- like not taking such a hard stand either way and I don't know if that's because of dating situation if that's because. It's bad to have an opinion on those other directions and so like I don't know how we'll ever get to that conversation then right because he is obviously leading one way but then we were talking about it it was much more open. He did mention he doesn't necessarily like conflict. So there could be something that in there like an idea that is. Tough on like a first date necessarily balance, right? Yeah and I think there are just so many variables to he knows he's being recorded. We all know that this is being recorded. So we know what the popular opinion is. Yes but did you at any point feel like you learned something new from him in New perspective a new way of looking at something. And thinking back on it I think like that's why I worry I was like maybe it was just me challenging him all the time. But I think what I learned wasn't necessarily about a specific opinion that he shared with me that was new. I think what I learned was that people don't have to be aggressive with their views though like even still it it was more in how he approached the conversation with me and how I approached it with him. I told some of my friends right before this like I'm GonNa go you know on this? Dave. Know someone who might vote for trump and everyone's like, no Oh, my God give me out of it. You know. And I think you automatically think it's GonNa be a horrible experience, and even if you probably take some of the sound bites of what we eat sat for the opposite side that sounds like males on the scratch board and people like us like how you say that. But I think the fact that we were having such a good conversation keeping it. So respectful keeping it open not reacting. So quickly like that, I think that was what I really took away from that with him. It definitely changed in the sense that it was a little. There was more tension right It's more heated. It's more personal especially for me I think I shared a lot of personal stories with him especially how politics shapes near personally. So I think that definitely changes the mood. Did that bring you like sometimes when you share personal stories brings you closer to bring it closer to him or was it more like you defending your point of view? No, it wasn't me defending.

01:15:07 - 01:20:00

In. Some ways I don't know how much closer because I think it has to be on his side sharing some personal stuff to warrant to be like. To really bring you closer together. I will say though that I felt comfortable to do that like he allowed me to do that. He gave me space to do that which was good. and. I think that we I didn't feel I didn't feel distance like it didn't bring us further apart by any means out say that which it could do the first half of the day you had a lot more in common than you thought you would in the second half date, you're saying there wasn't much in common. Do you think the disagreements outweigh the commonalities or other way round the actually to be honest the second half the day I found a things we actually I should have gone back we were they had things in common not politics. Are Histories and in some ways be looked at as very similar. We just ended up coming to different conclusions. You grew up in a call to. Say maybe not that part but you know that was talking about how her college it was like all on him to figure out how to get there. My parents didn't have the tools resources to share with me like about that. I was just lucky enough to have a school system that put that structure in place for me 'cause I didn't have that in place in I had that but my siblings didn't have it. He has the same thing for him like. He had. His Way to college by himself he did that his siblings didn't do that like his mother has never voted for very different reasons right because of religiously how they were raised my dad has never voted. For very different reasons you know so. I. Think there have more in common, but it's surprising because the things that at the end of the day come down to it's still separate us like even the have the same. Like some same shared history things for staying. So okay. So if you would have the date on a scale of one to ten, taking the virtual piece out because I feel like that's a little hard in general as much as you can. How would you rate it? Obviously ten being the best. I really give it a six point five, seven. Ed. Yes. Yeah okay round. Wise seven that's pretty high. It's high because I also I told you guys go into my expectations were so low and. Go into this I, don't know what he's going to be like if he's been rummy you the wrong way, it'd be really aggressive views. He probably like vice versa I mean he could have me by think just because it was open it felt comfortable I was nervous going into it that lost my nerves you know and there wasn't anything. Yeah I think because I felt comfortable it was fine. It was I mean I watched you guys like a little. You were just like chatted away. I was actually kind of blown away Yeah Kiki always has something to say. Romantics. Skills of one to ten. How would you rate the romantic potential of Tom I o head unfortunately for that? Like closer like four tie explain. Because like I don't know I it's actually hard on like I wonder what? Circumstances with more time like could we come to more common ground but like? The things that do separate us are so personal to me that it's hard to overcome. So when someone says to me, you know trump's is. I mean, he they think they're his bark is worse than is by for me that Barkman so much and so I think one of the biggest things in a partner partner for me to be understood is such a huge saying to be like to feel like I'm very understood and so I don't know if I could feel understood in that situation which turned takes the romance away from me for that. So I kept hearing him say, I, empathize with you but you still didn't feel like he like her Jew. A felt he empathized with me and I definitely less. I. Say I do like that and I do here but then he said it again, which made me feel like, okay maybe he doesn't. Fully get it for me but I don't know I. Don't know because like I said I don't know if that would just take more time to getting know someone I met him for the first time I'm not expecting him to change. Right like after meeting one time but I get. That's or action be expecting anyone change. That's my partner in general right? You should expect. Dot changes views. Yeah exactly. which is I think the hardest part of that which will make to makes me not feel that romance there because I'm like I'm going into it wanting to change someone.

01:20:01 - 01:25:09

Okay. So that being said, would you go on a second date if it was socially distanced? This is so hard because like part of me is like more I don't know if. The attraction was there from that point of view but I'm like is that because it's virtual as layup I, I don't know I mean finding it very hard in my gut the spark is not there I think the other part of me is like, do I put too much emphasis on the spark welcome to girl lives and we'll talk about all the time. So many injured no conflict wasn't the answer. Yeah but really. Spot I would I would try it again a very much on the fence about it like not like sold but I think I would try and see where I got I would probably one more. And then taking tom out of the equation, would you be open to going out with someone again, that is known to be Republican or potentially voting for trump or definitely voting for trump yes I would be open to it again I think this was a very positive experience in the sense of like I can have a conversation I think the other thing here just so you guys know that's also hard thinking about long-term with anyone future with anyone even if I can come to some personal understanding, my whole social circle will likely not. And I think that is also very difficult when you're your life is not lived in. You don't live by yourself in a bubble in a vacuum, right? Like you have to integrate with other people and I. think that's also very difficult. So it's hard for me to like I will on another, but it is a big barrier to overcome care enough. Let's bring Tom Back on for a quick takeaways of the whole experience, and then we'll wrap up. This was so fascinating thing for participating this to start off with it took a lot of courage to do this. So thank you again for doing that. No, it was fine. I was really enjoyed for having very brave both of you and I feel like overall you both had a very similar output of the entire date. You're both kind of maybe undoing a second day you work hard yes or hard though, but you were both. Willing to potentially give it another chance. There is definitely a more fun five at the beginning and then the politics part I. Think you both use the word tension and not conflict, which is good. Tension is much more positive than conflict. Love that both of you had a very open mind going into this and just the fact that you agree to do this experiment just shows how open minded you are and knowing that this was in. A forum to debate but inform to discuss so very much. Appreciate both of you doing that a my major takeaway honestly is that it's all about the context in the mindset of how you start date. Both of you came into this knowing that there's a really high chance we don't agree on certain fundamental things but I'm still gonNA go into the state because it's an interesting experiment and I'm open to forming a romantic connection with. Someone who may have opposing beliefs I think won't it comes to everyday modern dating we go into dates thinking is this person going to like me I? Want them to like me even if you're like not that interested, it becomes this winning game I want this person to like me. So I think the context made us. So different that you're you're able to form a deeper connection have more of an open discussion. Yeah I think my. Biggest takeaway from this whole thing is that we could say like you were both kind of more. You're not even extreme on both sides yet. You did still disagree on a lot of the fundamentals and I think we can't make politics. Stage is no longer just about policies that could all Bexley up let's be honest for what it is. It is social values. It is values in general I don't think this experiment has proved that. Necessarily to people can date for the long term. It might prove that people can be open to a short term arrangement to have a couple dates do that civilly but I think what I've taken away from this is I think it's important to have the conversations about politics and anything that's values I totally do, and I actually went on a date recently, we spent the whole time about politics we agreed. So it wasn't like a conflict. But I walked away being with I, don't know if I like formed a romantic connection because we were talking about such deep things like from the start and I do think there is something about dating of like being a little later on the first state like similar to the first half of your date in not saying that you should never talk about the deeper stuff but that kinda comes on day two or three like as you're. Getting to know each other and you've built up that report because I think you both mentioned it's hard to have a disagreement with someone when you barely know them. So it's like you're kind of holding back. So I think it's like forming that bond I in then having the harder discussions I mean I will just say just chiming in here like maybe it's like we don't need to be talking about politics actually all the time now.

01:25:09 - 01:30:02

says. The off. It's like we don't need to have these discussions like we need to actually just be spending time with each other and figuring out what like having fun together and like figuring out what we do have in common and maybe the rest of that does come in later down the line as we share but I mean we're not changing either of our opinions tonight. Like that's not gonNA happen. So maybe it's actually more about the fact that we were able to have fun. We were able to have conversation and be respectful and form a connection albeit maybe not even necessarily romantic but like that's almost more important right now I think that's a it's so interesting what you said earlier Kiki and I'll fill you in Tom. Kiki said we actually come from very similar backgrounds in terms of timeline and. How we arrived at some of the beliefs that we currently do and it seems like a formed around college time. So imagine if you met in college and dated then yeah and then formed your political opinions I. Bet you anything you'll be so different. Now everything changes when you are in a partnership with someone, their fight becomes your fight to. So then it's not silos in your own experience, but you're both coming in on chew independent trains. Pulling into the same station, it's a little harder right because you're not like trying to combine the two trains So again it's it goes back into the context I. Have the other thing too. It's like politics is just one of many lake before we make these. Judgments of each other based on our political views like let's just get to know each other a little more like even in the process of screening people like I i. Mean I admit I definitely lead more left for sure and I talked to a lot of Republican women and men in this process and people are like are throwing around these like really bold statements. Like all Republicans are racists and it's like, no, I talked to people I know that's not the case for so I think we need to start seeing each other as individuals and I love like what Tom you're saying both of you actually like, why is there only two parties like why can't we be independent I? Think by having those two parties, it's sets us all. Judgment and sometimes that's done on purpose to separate us and make us feel than we really are slit sight after the election. We don't know what the results are going to be nor do we know what whether it's trump or biden? We don't really know what the future is GonNa look like, but it could be whatever form it takes it could be that some of the current controversies kind of blow over whatever that may look like do people who are having a very intense or heated discussion right now. Of you months from now might. Might get along get along better without. So much of the heat antigen even if even if they still tend to disagree on some this or that political or philosophical question. Yeah I mean I know we're talking about in a dating setting, but I think this extends to like friends and family and everything else you know what I mean I think we are just like so quick to write each other off right now I think that there may be room for. All of us just kind of like it would be nice to take down the animosity intention that were also doing as a nation just like a nudge like I feel like I would have more breathing room to even like be able to think and evaluate how I feel without it being heightened all time like constantly fueled and energize like you know ready for battle even just taking it down with each other would just go such a long way and yes, like. Dating. I do think you have to like. Eventually, like touch on these topics like sooner rather than later maybe like just get to understand like some of this but I think like take that lesson an extended even just beyond dating though and maybe it's not like the first day like it's kind of like when you ask someone like what they're looking for, they're looking for like marriage and kids you don't ask that on. The first date before you even decide if you'd like them as a person. So it's like maybe with politics similar, let's I knock off like if this is even a good fit like everything else aside, and then let's go to those deeper questions. I think maybe it's not politics or which party that you support but it's there are some fundamental values that people should agree on like racism. Racism is a major one for me. I WOULD WANNA be aligned on that on our first date not necessarily Democrat versus Republican I think that could come a separate conversation. I think politics is just so personal to people this year especially that. If if the way you treat politics is exactly how someone else may be treating their politics two. So we have to be more sensitive when we approached these opposing views or opposite. Perspectives 'cause you're it's a personal attack that someone may take that us.

01:30:02 - 01:35:11

So it's interesting to me because it's politics are like the glasses you were given to see the world, and if you're seeing it in one pair of glasses, it's really hard to see it from someone else glasses. And it's so innate in us. Now to to believe in certain things that it's almost as hard as explaining why is my hair black someone's like your hair is blocked why is it I have to explain something that was given to me and it's so ingrained in me. So I think we all. The takeaway there is we all have to step back and questioned ourselves. Why is it that I believe in this and why do I think it is so important for me for my partner to be alive aligned on the same thing I love that and I think values is core to everything right? Like it is. I. Think I, guess the question. I. Have for all of you here. We can all go around once we can wrap this up but like there's always been the systematic thing that Talk about politics on a date. After this experiment after everything we know what do we think there? And let's give you the scenario. Let's say it's after the elections. And it's still topic and you go on a date with someone. Is this something you should bring up? Who did you vote for? What do you think about the elections? How do you feel about the results? I think because politics are so personal right now. I mean like you said and it's very value-based I. I think you bring up the things that matter to you. I think you bring up the values that matter to you on the first day if I think. So but I don't think you go into it ready for a fight. I think you go into it ready to listen and being very open but I do their you have to have. But I just think that it's the way we're approaching it. That's kind of off and it doesn't have to be Democrat Republican etc. it just has to be like what is your value base behind this? So I can understand you NC if you understand me. Generally speaking my generally speaking my inclination is is not necessarily to go there too much on a on a first date and I I don't really envision that changing after the election if it does come up comes up case by case basis. I think for me what is opened my mind is it might not be like are you a Republican argues a Democrat like so black and white but I will definitely talk about values and how they feel about the current president in the values day upholds I would just freely talk about it. Personally 'cause I. Think it's so it's important especially if it's right after the elections I'm sure everyone will have a reaction in one way or another. If you don't address it on first date, you're Kinda. Like ignoring the elephant in the room which I think makes even more awkward. So I think from this whole experiment I guess what I've learned I think it's set. Up is politics still are factor for sure like that isn't going away at I think yes there could be an opportunity if both parties are willing to listen to each other however that being said, there is a barrier even if there are disagreements just given our environments given what politics means in this world today. All right. We're going to wrap this up. Thank you both so much for being brave, honest and open. To this experiment, not many people thought that they wanted to put themselves in this position. So thank you both for willing to do that and having an open discussion. It seems that you both said, you'd be willing to go on a second day in that could be IRA L. so we'll leave that up to you. If you think that could happen or not I won't put you on the spot. No blushes here we'll pass your emails along. DECIDE IF YOU WANT A. Door is open if you would like to open it. Okay and we want to thank our listeners. If you like to be part of future social experiments, we loved doing these dating experiments. So just reach out to us to find our contact at debut podcast, Dot Com and don't forget those reviews and Apple podcasts Han. Stars see play that we can do more of these social experiments. We could probably do like three or four in season we just knock them out reviews. That's right. We have way more that we plan for the rest of the rest of our lifetime basically. Okay. We're going to wrap this up stay. The dateable podcast is part of the FROLIC podcast network. Find more podcasts. You'll love at frolic dot media slash podcast to continue the conversation I follow us on Instagram facebook and twitter with the handle asked dateable podcasts tag as an any post with the Hashtag stay dateable and trust us. We look at all those posts then head over to our website dateable podcasts, dot com there you'll find all The episodes articles videos and our coaching service with vetted industry experts.

01:35:11 - 01:35:33

You can also find our premium y series where we dissect, analyze and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums, Roseau downloadable for free on spotify apple podcast. Google play overcast stitcher radio, and other podcasts platforms. Your feedback is valuable to us. So don't forget to leave us a review and most importantly remember to stay dateable.

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